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Adam Curry: On casting 2.0 For
April 2024, episode 175

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Everyone's an actor Hey, hello,
everybody, welcome to

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podcasting. 2.0 Before we get
started That's right. Once again

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for the official board meeting
of podcasting and podcasting 2.0

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We got it all happened here
everything going on a podcast

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index.org one is up with
podcasting two.org podcast index

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dot social. And of course we are
the only boardroom that

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encourages breaking your NDA.
I'm Adam curry here in the heart

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of the Texas Hill Country and in
Alabama, the man who reads

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Chesterton's neritic so you
don't have to say hello to my

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friend on the other end. Dave
Jones.

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Dave Jones: Hang on one sec. I'm
sending a boost.

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Adam Curry: What are you doing?
What are you doing? What are you

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doing?

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Dave Jones: I'm seeing the
booster pod news weekly review.

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Oh, rich guest or OKC rich guest
or a pod casts network.

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Adam Curry: I thought exactly
the same thing. And I'm like,

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okay, so rich guy starts a
podcast network thinks he can

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monetize the network hires five
celebrities, one of which was

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the host of Big Brother UK. And
boy, it's gonna be different.

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Dave Jones: This time, it's
gonna rip this time.

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Adam Curry: This time, it'll
really work.

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Dave Jones: For you all the
times it didn't this. This one's

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different.

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Adam Curry: I mean, is this guy
basically the British Mark Cuban

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is that isn't he from Dragon's
Den?

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Dave Jones: That seems like
exactly what this this is

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fireside chat all over again. Or
whatever that thing was. Well,

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actually he'll get Okay. Okay. I
know. We don't have a red book

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for predictions. Yeah. I don't
know what we have. But I want to

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make a prediction. Right. Okay.
April the 12th at 12:35pm.

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Adam Curry: Here we go. All
right.

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Dave Jones: Steven Bart.
Bartlett. Yes. Will will be the

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keynote speaker at next at
Podcast Movement. Next year.

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Maybe this year. sometime within
the next two years, he will be a

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keynote speaker at Podcast
Movement, aka you know, Allah,

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Mark Cuban.

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Adam Curry: The only thing that
that I thought I might make this

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a little bit different is it's
not just flight studio, which is

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their podcast, podcast network.
But they have flight story.

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Which is Oh, it's a it's a
marketing communications

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company. So so they'll be making
branded podcasts pretty soon.

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Hey, look at all these stars.
Look at all the stars. We can

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have host your content. Yeah.
This

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Dave Jones: is so the I

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Adam Curry: mean, it's just so
obvious that this has been done

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over and over again and it just
keeps failing. This

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Dave Jones: is not a pod casts
network. This is a let's be

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honest, this is a YouTube Play
is what this is. Yeah.

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Adam Curry: Yes, yes. Yes. Yes.
Yes. Yeah.

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Dave Jones: First excuse me
video. Code for YouTube. Because

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that's the only video that even
matters at all in any anywhere

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in the world. You got one video
platform, YouTube. That's it.

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Well,

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Adam Curry: I will say I saw
something today. I boosted it. I

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boosted it on podcast index dot
social distinct called own cast.

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Own catheter. Cast yes own cast
is a I guess to make it simple.

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It's like Twitch for activity
pub.

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Dave Jones: I didn't see this
poster of yours. Where's Adam

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at? Private?

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Adam Curry: That's right. I was
boosting myself. Yeah, well, you

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can go to own cast. Oh, Oscar
whiskey November owned cast dot

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online boon cast.on

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Dave Jones: Oh TLD on cast dot
online. friable Yeah, yeah, no,

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this isn't this a fork of
something.

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Adam Curry: I don't know.

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Unknown: Maybe I'm wrong. That

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Adam Curry: could be your live
stream can reach a wider

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audience on the fediverse
allowing people to follow and

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share your stream on Mastodon
and other fediverse services. So

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I saw this and I thought, oh,
that's me. I know they do HLS

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video streams or whatever it is.
It just made me excited again

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about social interact and how
powerful we will be when we

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start to implement some of this.
I'm just going to start talking

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in the different holes now. We
will we will have our yes

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Because imagine a community of
apps. Imagine that imagine where

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your audience doesn't just live
on one app, it can live across

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apps, how we can connect, how we
can actually measure success.

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These aren't just connect
communities interconnect between

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shows, music networks, this is
all stuff I wrote down this

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morning.

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Dave Jones: Grow your show.

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Adam Curry: All right, you just
blew everything grow your show.

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Your show? Well, actually, yeah,
you could grow your show. I

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mean, it it's becoming, it's the
point where like, I'm gonna have

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to build an app, because I want
other person

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Dave Jones: to Adam, please
build an app.

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Adam Curry: And it'll be me and
Sam Southie doing this.

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Dave Jones: Please, please build
it.

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Adam Curry: I mean, I mean, I
see so much possibility. Imagine

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if I mean, all the all the cross
pollenization where you can, you

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can literally grow your show. I
hate to say it. But in fact, we

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just kind of hijack that grow.
Your show was socially interact.

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Of course, you can grow your
show. Because then you can see

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across apps as an app developers
like, hey, I can I can surface

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stuff that people are following
or subscribe to on all apps, not

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just mine, on all apps. Now I
can see ratings. I think, I

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think I'm just calling it social
interact. Because somehow the

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common thing is just freaking
everybody. I don't care. I don't

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even care if it's comments. I
don't care. I just want the

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connection between the apps.

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Dave Jones: Actually best if
it's not comments.

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Adam Curry: I agree.

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Dave Jones: I agree. I don't
know what that means. But, but

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Adam Curry: I like it. I like it
felt like Yeah, it feels good.

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If you say

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Dave Jones: things that you
feel, and you figure out what

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they mean later,

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Adam Curry: I mean, it's just
just subscribe numbers. Just

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subscribe, hey, I subscribe this
stuff, interactions

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Dave Jones: as well, you're
talking to them like,

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immediately, I started thinking
about what airhead posted the

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other day?

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Adam Curry: What I usually read
his stuff, what do you post? He,

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Dave Jones: he was talking about
audio books. And he was saying

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that he was having a hard time
finding any apps that supported

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audio books in the way that you
would expect them to be

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supported. And sorry, I just why
don't you just find this post

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and

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Adam Curry: what did you do?
That

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Dave Jones: just had an add
moment? Comment from John

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Spurlock testing

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Adam Curry: audio book support
are there and the apps I've

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tested so far show the chapters
in the order they show up in the

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RSS feed ignoring both the
episode numbers and the order

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display director for Are there
any afterwards? This works?

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Okay. I understand. Okay.

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Dave Jones: Yeah. Basically,
there's there's there's

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production of audio book taking
place podcast. But there's no

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apps that read those feeds as if
they were what they're supposed

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to be and audio. Yeah. So
there's no, there's no audio

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book app. There's what is when
he writes, right, right. And

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that's a problem that needs to
be solved. It's too bad. And I'm

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going to do it. I'm going to
solve if nobody else has a

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problem. I'm going to write an
audio book.

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Adam Curry: Why don't you and I
just build an app, you

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Dave Jones: build the app that
you said you wanted to

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Adam Curry: build? You build the
app. Now. Let's build the app

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together. So I'll be like, This
is how we do it. David, you go.

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Okay. And like we always do it.

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Dave Jones: Hey, should do this.
Okay.

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Adam Curry: We did it for 12
years, by the way, we're on

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episode 175. I think we are
officially three and a half

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years into this thing. Oh,
really? Yeah. Oh, three and a

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half years, I think.

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Dave Jones: Yeah. I didn't get
you anything.

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Adam Curry: Sorry. I sent you a
very expensive gift as I always

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do. You did? Not.

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Dave Jones: Sir. Three weeks or
three years, six month

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anniversary, sweetheart. I'm
not. I'm not actually joking

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about that. I mentioned this to
somebody probably a while back.

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And I really do want to write an
audio book app. Yeah. Yeah. I

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want to just get a basic
something out there. Because

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nobody seems interested. And,
and you know, we're not we're

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not competing with apps here.
That's anathema. But if it's,

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what I'm talking about is
something that does purely

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audiobooks. And then it only
shows audio book, excuse me.

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Medium equals audio book. It
feeds in then, as soon as

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somebody else adds audiobook
support to their app, or as soon

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as somebody else writes an app
that does audiobooks, I'll just

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yank it.

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Adam Curry: And in this audio
book app, do you envision

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chapters? Or is it episodes of
an audio book and an audiobook

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be something that is serialized
so so so for instance, let's say

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Adam liked that idea so much
that he wanted to create his

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audio book of his life, which is

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Dave Jones: the subtitle will
help you have a working subtitle

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Yes, yes,

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Adam Curry: yes. held hostage by
my hair is the subtitle my life

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my life in media held hostage by
my hair. Yes, that is my title.

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My

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Dave Jones: Autobiography will
be Dave Jones. Oh crap.

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Adam Curry: So if you build the
app, I'll record the book. Okay,

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yeah, for sure. For sure it's

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Dave Jones: a it's a deal
handshake handshake

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Adam Curry: it is right but But
going back to social interact I

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just don't know how to motivate
people I think that I'm just I'm

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just flapping in the wind like
curry doesn't know what he's

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talking about. He's got no ideas
yet these ideas are never any

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good.

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Dave Jones: That's why the audio
book thing piqued my he like

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popped up into my head is
because when you when you sit

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it's like, there can be
discussions about audiobooks

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There you go audiobooks.
Comments are clearly but then

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there's also going to be like, I
can see like recommendation

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activity public recommendation
engines and stuff like that that

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could come out of it. You know,

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Adam Curry: I hate to say this,
but I'm gonna say thank you.

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Thank you for the boost
interruption pew pew. What's

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been on my mind a lot lately and
and please take this with, with

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the love that I'm saying this.
Advertising has been on my mind

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a lot. And I wouldn't say
advertising is the right word.

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But underwriting underwriting
corporate sponsorship

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advertising, call it whatever
you want. Because while we all

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see that the advertising model
for podcast is severely broken,

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it just doesn't work. I mean,
it's not it's not a it's not

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trustworthy. How about that,
then it's not trustworthy,

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because it's not it's like
Nielsen's aren't trustworthy,

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either. But everybody trust
them, you know, the IAB thing is

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just not panning out. And, and I
still think that it would be to

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everybody's benefit if we could
figure some of that out. And

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this also works with social
interact. Because there are many

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things that we can ask listeners
to that podcasters can ask

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listeners to do like, turn on
the listen button to support

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support me while I tell you
about this great product. And if

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we all did that we could be the
platform recognizable by the new

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podcasting to logo. Yeah, yes.
That would actually have some

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accurate listen numbers at you
know, and I wouldn't use it

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because I'm just not into, into
messing up my con. It's just not

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how I live I live value for
value. But we'd be foolish,

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foolish if we didn't capture
this obvious opportunity. It's

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an obvious opportunity. Because
when when the money comes to

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the, to the places where the
apps are, the audience comes the

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users come. I was just something
to think about.

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Dave Jones: Yeah, so the the ad
so are you talking about are you

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talking about advertising as far
as in listens and stuff like

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that? You don't the accuracy of
all that kind of thing? Yeah.

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Based on like, well, there's,

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Adam Curry: there's a couple of
things. But first of all, I love

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the DI direct inquiry. I love it
when someone I mean, we know

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agenda as an example. So we have
Linda Lou Potkin who donates

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$200 Every show she'd be doing
it for over two years now, I

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think. And all she says is you
know what, I think she has a

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resume she does executive
resumes. And she doesn't she

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doesn't, you know, I don't even
remember what the what the

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domain name is. But she doesn't
even mention that just look for

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me, Linda patcon and we got some
other guy who donates $200

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Almost every every show, which
is by the way I gigawatt Coffee

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Roasters use code ITM 20. Now,
is that advertising? I don't

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have to read it. I don't mind
reading it. It's probably a

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great CPM. If I thought about
it, I don't know it doesn't

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matter. Button in that that type
of stuff. I always like you

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know, obviously something's
working for them, otherwise they

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wouldn't be donating that Yeah,
and it's you know, it for me

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it's value. There's always a
note about the show. It's not

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just about, but I'm not gonna
read ad copy, we just don't do

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that. But we have a boost
button, why not have a click

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through button? This whole bunch
of things that we just because

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we are value for value, I think
we're selling ourselves short of

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a great opportunity. That's all
I'm saying.

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Dave Jones: But I don't know
what you mean. Like,

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Adam Curry: what I mean, or what
I mean, is that the advertising

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is not working on podcasting,
because there's no way to

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measure success. Right, by
implementing things that allow

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the users to feed back, like I
listened to this, or, Hey, we

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could do right now in a Chapter,
you know, look at your phone

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right now. Click on the link in
the chapters.

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Dave Jones: I think as a way,
let me see. Let me see if I

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understand what you're saying.
Because there's lots of barf

250
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going on in the chat room. Yeah.
Because,

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Adam Curry: yeah, I understand
that. But you know, you're

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idiots. Go ahead and circle
around like a bunch of turns

253
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into pisspot. The opportunity is
huge right now. I'm not going to

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do I'm not going to do
advertising. But there's

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millions of people who want
this. And they're going to

256
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YouTube. Great. Meanwhile,
Mitch, Mitch is struggling.

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Everybody's struggling, because
there's no money coming in.

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Dave Jones: I think I understand
what you're saying, though. But

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I think what you're, if I
understand it, you're saying

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that the the way advertising is,
is has been done is

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traditionally always been done
within podcasting. That method

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clearly does not work Correct.
For night, let's just say for

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99% of podcasters. That does not
work. And that is an end. So

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we've, we've lumped when we talk
about advertising, we talk about

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it in those terms. But there is
another way. The in the other

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way is value for value. But
advertising, our advertisers are

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welcome at the

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Adam Curry: table. Why not?
Yeah.

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Dave Jones: Because like, it's
like somebody? Well, I mean,

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think about it. That's what
isn't.

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Adam Curry: Do you hate your Do
you hate your television?

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Because you can also watch a
channel with ads? No, you just

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don't watch the channel with
ads.

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Dave Jones: Okay, well, maybe
I'm still Mr. Just because

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because what I'm thinking is
like, I mean, people, pot page,

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by page sins, 25 bucks to US a
month to help us out. Because

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they because Brendon over there
appreciates what we were doing

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here. But also it helps. It's an
advertisement for him. Like I

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mean, he gets we say that we say
that we say pod page, every

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shirt shirt is so like, it's not
I think I think I understand. I

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think I'm understanding that
you're saying value for value is

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not advertiser. advertiser
exclusion, exclusionary?

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Adam Curry: I think you're
correct. Okay, sir. Cal from

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lavender, Lavender blossoms.org.
I mean, we haven't lost people,

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because these people come in and
donate. We haven't lost that

286
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boat. I have no way to help
them. measure the success of

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what they're doing.

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Dave Jones: Do but Right. Yeah,
yeah. Right. Yeah. And also how

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to write but they evidently can,
because they keep doing it.

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Well, they are they have a feel
for

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Adam Curry: an ROI. They have an
ROI that obviously is working

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somehow. But beyond that, but
beyond that. Podcast stats,

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they're useless. They really
are. They're useless. If I ask

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people, Hey, I'd like to know
who's listening. Could you could

295
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you could you toggle that button
in your app, people will do it.

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But I'm not asking you to send
me your your life. I'm just

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saying, Hey, I just want to know
if you listen to something how

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far you listen to something.
Now, we kind of have that with

299
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streaming sets, which is where
this comes from, because I love

300
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those statistics. I'd love that.
I'm just saying that. As

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podcast. Infrastructure
developers forget the content

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00:19:21,600 --> 00:19:23,790
for a second because there's
nothing that I hate more than

303
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pre rolls mid rolls. I hate
that. I hate dynamically

304
00:19:27,420 --> 00:19:31,530
inserted ads. I hate ads on the
radio. I hate ads on television.

305
00:19:31,530 --> 00:19:37,050
I hate it all I hate. It's
offensive. I don't like it. But

306
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even pivot which is a show I
hate which I which I forced

307
00:19:41,460 --> 00:19:45,930
myself to listen to. I'll listen
to their ads that they are

308
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reading because they read them.
And they're actually interesting

309
00:19:48,930 --> 00:19:51,420
ads because they're products
that you don't typically hear

310
00:19:51,420 --> 00:19:56,070
about. So, value value for
value. Just put that over here

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for a second as a as a complete
platform. Just think about how

312
00:20:01,200 --> 00:20:06,630
powerful it would be. If this
group of apps over here had ways

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for you as a marketer, I'm not
saying an advertiser a marketer

314
00:20:10,350 --> 00:20:15,870
to measure success, whatever
that means to you, because we

315
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have connected these apps into
something much bigger. It may

316
00:20:19,860 --> 00:20:24,930
be, maybe it's just to see the
rating of your ratings, real

317
00:20:24,930 --> 00:20:28,140
ratings are bullcrap. It's just
it's just to get higher on the

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00:20:28,140 --> 00:20:33,150
on the on the iTunes chart. But
to have real subscriber numbers

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that are across this, you know,
20 apps. We're not doing that is

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00:20:40,740 --> 00:20:44,370
we're just missing out. We're
missing out on a huge

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opportunity. We're the only
group that can do it, and we

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would kill everybody.

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Dave Jones: Yeah, I think I
think I understand what you're

324
00:20:54,150 --> 00:21:00,030
saying. It's a way you can say,
well, it's this, this goes back

325
00:21:00,030 --> 00:21:05,070
to that way of thinking where
you say, like the Apple,

326
00:21:05,070 --> 00:21:08,880
Microsoft thing we, we don't
have to, they don't have to lose

327
00:21:08,880 --> 00:21:09,780
for us to win.

328
00:21:11,070 --> 00:21:13,560
Adam Curry: Yeah, you can say
that. You can say that.

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00:21:13,740 --> 00:21:18,360
Dave Jones: Yeah. Because you
say, Well, I'm not gonna, I'm

330
00:21:18,360 --> 00:21:24,300
not going to change or my
content or censor my content or

331
00:21:24,300 --> 00:21:29,070
anything like that. I'm still in
control of my content. And if

332
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you want to participate in value
for value as an advertiser,

333
00:21:32,760 --> 00:21:34,980
you're free to you're welcome to
do so. You're more than you're

334
00:21:34,980 --> 00:21:38,640
more than Yes. Yes. We're glad
for you to participate. But

335
00:21:38,640 --> 00:21:43,530
you're not. But we're not going
to do. But we're not going to be

336
00:21:43,530 --> 00:21:46,650
quote, ad supported. No, not.
Oh,

337
00:21:46,800 --> 00:21:50,280
Adam Curry: yeah. Again, again,
television cable. So it's all

338
00:21:50,280 --> 00:21:55,110
great platforms. Right? It's
great platforms. I don't hate it

339
00:21:55,110 --> 00:21:59,100
because there are channels on
that platform that shabads I

340
00:21:59,100 --> 00:22:04,230
don't hate my television. I just
don't watch that. But I am using

341
00:22:04,230 --> 00:22:08,460
a television, I'm using that
device, abusing that app, to

342
00:22:08,460 --> 00:22:12,540
give give give, give the money,
people some reason to come and

343
00:22:12,540 --> 00:22:15,990
use stuff, and maybe change what
advertising means in the

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00:22:15,990 --> 00:22:20,850
meantime, you know, because for
sure, what's hurting us right

345
00:22:20,850 --> 00:22:27,270
now is pre rolls, I would say 60
to 70% of people, when they get

346
00:22:27,270 --> 00:22:31,890
a pre roll think the app is
doing it? Yeah. It's

347
00:22:31,920 --> 00:22:36,660
unbelievable. I pay premium for
pod verse, how come I'm getting

348
00:22:36,660 --> 00:22:43,920
ads. It's, It's sickening. We
need we need to get rid of that.

349
00:22:44,700 --> 00:22:45,090
Well,

350
00:22:45,120 --> 00:22:47,700
Dave Jones: in you know, and
we're kind of just speaking for

351
00:22:47,700 --> 00:22:51,660
us on this, you know, show in
the podcast index, we were kind

352
00:22:51,660 --> 00:22:55,350
of already doing that. Because
if, like, I mean, that might

353
00:22:55,350 --> 00:22:58,410
we're doing that mindset,
because people ask us from time

354
00:22:58,410 --> 00:23:02,220
to time, like, you know, hey,
can we use the index? Or can we

355
00:23:02,220 --> 00:23:04,050
do this kind of thing, and they
want to have some sort of

356
00:23:04,050 --> 00:23:07,620
financial arrangement? And we
always, our standard response is

357
00:23:07,620 --> 00:23:10,140
always just No, I mean, if you
know, you use it, and if you

358
00:23:10,140 --> 00:23:13,650
like it, donate and we'll read
your yes, we'll read your

359
00:23:13,650 --> 00:23:16,980
donation on, you know, on the
show, and you'll get, you'll get

360
00:23:16,980 --> 00:23:20,670
the publicity that way. But
you're just gonna line up and

361
00:23:20,670 --> 00:23:23,310
donate like everybody else, you
know, this special platform

362
00:23:23,310 --> 00:23:27,420
privileges, yes. And if you
know, and you don't have to, if

363
00:23:27,420 --> 00:23:28,740
you don't want to, but beyond

364
00:23:28,740 --> 00:23:31,530
Adam Curry: that, Dave, just as
a platform was just think out of

365
00:23:31,530 --> 00:23:35,550
the box for a second. And for
me, there's, you've got an RSS

366
00:23:35,550 --> 00:23:38,970
feed with enclosures, whether
that's music, whether that's an

367
00:23:39,000 --> 00:23:42,810
audio book, whether it's whether
it's a long form podcast,

368
00:23:42,810 --> 00:23:46,170
whether it's a Bible sermon,
whether it's you just doing

369
00:23:46,170 --> 00:23:50,910
Gregorian chants, that's a
podcast, I don't care. I don't

370
00:23:50,910 --> 00:23:58,200
care if there's no difference to
me. But if we really want to

371
00:23:58,200 --> 00:24:02,250
lift up what we're doing here,
we would be in and we are being

372
00:24:02,520 --> 00:24:07,800
very jihadist about the
advertising part, the market

373
00:24:07,800 --> 00:24:09,780
when we could just call it
marketing and not advertising

374
00:24:09,810 --> 00:24:16,950
then as better. And if we can
connect all of our apps. So that

375
00:24:17,310 --> 00:24:21,600
podcasters This is the number
one I think podcasters can grow

376
00:24:21,600 --> 00:24:26,790
their show, because there's
interaction between apps. So

377
00:24:26,790 --> 00:24:32,160
it's not just one app, it's 10
or 15, or 20 apps, that all have

378
00:24:32,160 --> 00:24:35,520
some kind of interaction, but I
like my app for you know, for

379
00:24:35,520 --> 00:24:39,030
the stuff it does for me. Now,
some people like the processing

380
00:24:39,030 --> 00:24:41,850
of the sound, the skipping the
speed button, the way it

381
00:24:41,850 --> 00:24:44,940
portrays art, um, there's all
different reasons. It's a very

382
00:24:44,940 --> 00:24:51,030
personal thing. But the but that
we can have we really feel like

383
00:24:51,030 --> 00:24:55,860
we need to connect into some
form of platform because then

384
00:24:55,860 --> 00:25:00,990
we'll be will be, we will
accelerate past What the so

385
00:25:00,990 --> 00:25:02,370
called Big boys can do?

386
00:25:04,560 --> 00:25:08,310
Dave Jones: Did you know I mean,
I get where you're coming from

387
00:25:08,310 --> 00:25:12,300
on the technology side of that
with activity pub. And the way

388
00:25:12,300 --> 00:25:16,800
that that could could enable
something like that as the

389
00:25:16,800 --> 00:25:19,890
attribution and stuff. I just,
it's like, but once you go down

390
00:25:19,890 --> 00:25:23,250
that road, then you're, then
that's where the that's where

391
00:25:23,250 --> 00:25:26,820
the scam start. And that's where
the fraudulent what scam? What

392
00:25:27,240 --> 00:25:28,170
Adam Curry: were you talking
about?

393
00:25:28,470 --> 00:25:31,080
Dave Jones: Are you talking?
You're talking about enabling

394
00:25:31,080 --> 00:25:33,840
some sort of attribution over
activitypub? No, no, I'm

395
00:25:33,840 --> 00:25:36,840
Adam Curry: talking about
attribution. No, no, no. Like a

396
00:25:36,840 --> 00:25:41,040
social interact. Yeah, social
interest. So yeah, so but that's

397
00:25:41,040 --> 00:25:44,550
not that's not to attribution. I
have no interest in attribution.

398
00:25:45,060 --> 00:25:48,750
I'm talking about social
interact. Yes, I like this. Yes.

399
00:25:48,750 --> 00:25:51,570
I've subscribed to this. Yes. So
follow this. Here's what I have

400
00:25:51,570 --> 00:25:56,550
to say about this. Yes, I
listened to this. All these

401
00:25:56,550 --> 00:26:00,630
things are social interactions
that benefit the show, benefit

402
00:26:00,630 --> 00:26:04,710
the community around each show
benefit cross community, because

403
00:26:04,710 --> 00:26:09,240
the eye can see an app, then
saying, Wow, here's a

404
00:26:09,240 --> 00:26:14,040
recommendation. And you could
eat them in technically, you

405
00:26:14,040 --> 00:26:18,180
could recommend a show that's
doing well over on your app to

406
00:26:18,180 --> 00:26:20,280
someone who's listening on
another app. I mean, you

407
00:26:20,280 --> 00:26:24,750
understand what I'm saying? Like
activity throb enables, it's a

408
00:26:24,750 --> 00:26:28,410
whole new world of things that
we can enable. And yes,

409
00:26:28,500 --> 00:26:33,750
marketers can benefit from that
as well. in new ways, not with

410
00:26:33,750 --> 00:26:37,020
dynamic ad insertion in new
ways.

411
00:26:37,410 --> 00:26:39,810
Dave Jones: You're just saying
you're saying that those new

412
00:26:39,810 --> 00:26:44,970
ways are interacting with the
show through activity pub

413
00:26:44,970 --> 00:26:45,660
channels.

414
00:26:46,320 --> 00:26:47,880
Adam Curry: Well, whatever. I
don't know if you call it

415
00:26:47,880 --> 00:26:51,060
channels or whatever, whatever.
Yeah, I mean, it just seems to

416
00:26:51,060 --> 00:26:55,020
me the word is the whole world
is connecting to activity, pub.

417
00:26:55,800 --> 00:27:00,930
And all and I mean, why can't
we, when I see that, what is it

418
00:27:00,930 --> 00:27:05,520
called? own caste? I'm like,
huh, there's something there.

419
00:27:05,670 --> 00:27:09,420
But shouldn't an own cast and
all that if it's a twitch like

420
00:27:09,450 --> 00:27:12,810
experience, should that flow
into my podcast app? Or do I

421
00:27:12,810 --> 00:27:15,390
know have to go to an own cast
webpage?

422
00:27:15,870 --> 00:27:19,080
Dave Jones: Well, I mean, peer
to peer tube is fully identity

423
00:27:19,080 --> 00:27:21,000
pub enabled ensures that. Sure.

424
00:27:21,270 --> 00:27:24,210
Adam Curry: And, and all this
stuff works on my app I've been

425
00:27:24,210 --> 00:27:26,820
I hate to think, oh, there's
video. Okay, that works fine.

426
00:27:27,060 --> 00:27:32,910
But I can't do like the own cast
live chat. No.

427
00:27:34,890 --> 00:27:39,900
Dave Jones: Well, okay, well,
let's, let's let's twist here

428
00:27:39,900 --> 00:27:47,040
into that, because awesome.
Oskar, ping me on email and said

429
00:27:47,040 --> 00:27:53,790
that his noster fountain live
chat relay thing is, is open,

430
00:27:53,790 --> 00:27:58,710
and he's got some instructions
on how that's how that works. So

431
00:27:58,740 --> 00:28:03,300
I will be starting to bridge
that as soon as possible, so

432
00:28:03,300 --> 00:28:06,690
that we can get the get live
chat.

433
00:28:09,240 --> 00:28:12,570
Adam Curry: In I wish I wish we
had I wish we had the same

434
00:28:12,570 --> 00:28:16,860
energy that that 10s of
developers are putting into

435
00:28:16,860 --> 00:28:21,060
noster as we in activity pub.

436
00:28:22,860 --> 00:28:27,720
Dave Jones: I really do. We do
know, there's the Oh, I think I

437
00:28:27,720 --> 00:28:31,320
think I think you're mistaken on
that. I mean, the energy, the

438
00:28:31,320 --> 00:28:35,430
energy of activity Pub is 1000
to one versus noster and because

439
00:28:35,430 --> 00:28:36,780
it's just distributed

440
00:28:38,100 --> 00:28:40,080
Adam Curry: no one you but no
one's putting that into our

441
00:28:40,080 --> 00:28:41,730
apps. Instead

442
00:28:41,730 --> 00:28:44,610
Dave Jones: of having a 15
developers working on stuff and

443
00:28:44,610 --> 00:28:47,850
nostre you have you know, 1500
developers working on stuff and

444
00:28:47,850 --> 00:28:53,130
activity pub, except for our
developers. Right? Oh, yes. Yes.

445
00:28:53,130 --> 00:28:56,970
Okay. I misunderstood your
point. Yeah. Are the the 2.0

446
00:28:57,150 --> 00:29:01,950
people seem well, I mean, the
ones that are the ones that are

447
00:29:02,340 --> 00:29:06,870
super active right now into
being nostril related but Oh,

448
00:29:06,870 --> 00:29:08,850
Adam Curry: yes. I mean we have
we have true fans and this is

449
00:29:08,850 --> 00:29:14,130
what I like about Sam Sam is
implementing a lot of stuff but

450
00:29:14,130 --> 00:29:18,270
there's no one else is doing it.
So he just kind of out there in

451
00:29:18,270 --> 00:29:20,370
the whim flapping away. Well,

452
00:29:20,370 --> 00:29:22,440
Dave Jones: that's what I'm
trying to bring. That's what I'm

453
00:29:22,440 --> 00:29:25,350
trying to bring the nostril
fountain stuff over to activity

454
00:29:25,350 --> 00:29:28,260
pub, that's what I'm trying to
bridge everything over is

455
00:29:28,260 --> 00:29:32,760
because that you know, there
there's one I want to take that

456
00:29:32,760 --> 00:29:39,300
energy you know, and instead of
it just like evaporating into

457
00:29:39,300 --> 00:29:44,550
the void, redirect it back
redirect that nostril

458
00:29:44,550 --> 00:29:50,400
development energy back into
activity pub ecosystem, I gotcha

459
00:29:50,400 --> 00:29:53,730
so that we can get the benefit
of and it doesn't just like I

460
00:29:53,730 --> 00:29:58,530
Adam Curry: got you. But that's
that's basically just Colorado

461
00:29:58,530 --> 00:30:01,500
Dave Jones: forgot about
Cassiopeia. Yeah,

462
00:30:02,220 --> 00:30:04,350
Adam Curry: I mean, yeah, what
is in Castle is? What is

463
00:30:05,549 --> 00:30:09,239
Dave Jones: fully activitypub
enabled from the ground up to

464
00:30:09,239 --> 00:30:09,659
everything,

465
00:30:10,050 --> 00:30:12,270
Adam Curry: as opposed to Yes.
As a hosting site. Yes,

466
00:30:12,270 --> 00:30:17,280
absolutely. Absolutely. So you
know, it's there. But we I don't

467
00:30:17,280 --> 00:30:20,040
I just don't understand why we
haven't connected at all because

468
00:30:20,040 --> 00:30:25,500
it to me, it's like I just see
this super, super opportunity

469
00:30:26,160 --> 00:30:27,930
for the for app developers.

470
00:30:28,740 --> 00:30:30,840
Dave Jones: What do you think
about it, though? I kind of it

471
00:30:30,840 --> 00:30:35,100
kind of makes sense of what, of
where we are as far as what, you

472
00:30:35,100 --> 00:30:39,390
know, we're. I see. I see. I
see. Everything isn't it isn't a

473
00:30:39,390 --> 00:30:45,930
very strange place. Because I
failed. Dave, understatement of

474
00:30:45,930 --> 00:30:56,670
the universe. The universe.
Yeah, the you have this. Say, Go

475
00:30:56,670 --> 00:31:00,180
ahead. Go ahead. Go ahead. Well,
you had Twitter, and Twitter.

476
00:31:00,210 --> 00:31:05,850
The Twitter's sort of implosion
was rapid. It was in and then

477
00:31:05,850 --> 00:31:10,500
you had before you had Mastodon
that was that was sort of the

478
00:31:10,770 --> 00:31:15,690
flagship of activity, pub,
applications and use cases.

479
00:31:16,410 --> 00:31:22,290
Activity Pub is sort of like the
trajectory of it is very similar

480
00:31:22,290 --> 00:31:26,580
to the trajectory of nostre. As
far as agree that ever the

481
00:31:26,610 --> 00:31:31,920
phases that it went through,
agreed in Macedon started a long

482
00:31:31,920 --> 00:31:38,370
time ago, as this as the flag
bearer for activity pub, as the

483
00:31:38,400 --> 00:31:42,750
alternative to Twitter, when
Twitter was still strong. So you

484
00:31:42,750 --> 00:31:46,590
had this so what what Mastodon
when it was Mastodon wanted to

485
00:31:46,710 --> 00:31:50,730
be was an alternative to
Twitter. And it was going to use

486
00:31:50,730 --> 00:31:53,550
activity pub to make that
happen. So it got a share a

487
00:31:53,550 --> 00:31:58,860
share of usage, based on that
mental model. This is an alt,

488
00:31:59,070 --> 00:32:08,400
Twitter. And so then Twitter
imploded and Mastodon went, it

489
00:32:08,400 --> 00:32:11,940
just went through the roof. And
so activity pub, therefore went

490
00:32:11,940 --> 00:32:17,040
through the roof. And these
other sort of more under the

491
00:32:17,040 --> 00:32:25,410
radar, activity, pub app,
projects, like pixel fed and

492
00:32:25,410 --> 00:32:29,790
these kinds of things came, came
onto the CN, N, peer tube and

493
00:32:29,790 --> 00:32:35,550
the N caster pod and these other
applications, they were trying

494
00:32:35,550 --> 00:32:39,150
to do something with something
deeper than just be a clone of a

495
00:32:39,150 --> 00:32:44,850
social network. And they just,
they are just now beginning to

496
00:32:44,850 --> 00:32:49,680
emerge. Because the social
network aspect of activity, pub

497
00:32:49,680 --> 00:32:53,460
became the dominant narrative.
And that same thing happened on

498
00:32:53,460 --> 00:32:58,470
noster. It you know, Nasir
became the alt Twitter for

499
00:32:58,470 --> 00:33:04,290
Bitcoin bros. And then it has,
it cannot seem to break out of

500
00:33:04,290 --> 00:33:09,990
that idea. And so it's take it
takes a long time for people to

501
00:33:09,990 --> 00:33:13,980
get past the notion of the thing
that the thing that was the

502
00:33:13,980 --> 00:33:18,030
dominant use case of a thing is
really all you do is all you can

503
00:33:18,030 --> 00:33:18,270
do.

504
00:33:18,270 --> 00:33:21,600
Adam Curry: Okay, I completely
agree. And so but here's the

505
00:33:21,600 --> 00:33:26,250
exception that that gets me all
excited when I go to podcast

506
00:33:26,250 --> 00:33:32,460
index.org and I go to this show,
or any of my shows, really, and

507
00:33:32,460 --> 00:33:36,870
I click on comments, it doesn't
look like a social network. It

508
00:33:36,870 --> 00:33:41,280
doesn't feel like Mastodon or
Twitter or threads. It looks

509
00:33:41,280 --> 00:33:45,630
like oh, there's some cool
comments that that's the

510
00:33:45,630 --> 00:33:53,280
difference right there. But I
believe that people between apps

511
00:33:53,280 --> 00:33:59,670
should be able to collaborate on
creating my chapters I mean,

512
00:33:59,730 --> 00:34:05,220
Daniel J Lewis his life would be
changed if we had ratings or

513
00:34:05,220 --> 00:34:12,780
stars or whatever it is that
goes between apps not because I

514
00:34:12,780 --> 00:34:17,280
think you're right because of
the social network aspect

515
00:34:17,280 --> 00:34:21,780
everybody shy I am I really
don't want to part of it. And

516
00:34:21,810 --> 00:34:25,950
Mastodon you know that I mean,
honestly, podcast index dot

517
00:34:25,950 --> 00:34:31,020
social to me. I love podcasts
index dot social. That's the

518
00:34:31,020 --> 00:34:33,930
first thing I go to everyday
it's the last thing I look at at

519
00:34:33,930 --> 00:34:42,270
night, my own psyops shop which
is by the way I've blocked no

520
00:34:42,270 --> 00:34:44,940
authority dot social from
podcasts index dot social

521
00:34:44,940 --> 00:34:49,140
because I hate that stuff coming
into that our little club our

522
00:34:49,140 --> 00:34:57,660
little area, I despise I despise
my own my own master Master, my

523
00:34:57,660 --> 00:35:00,690
own Mastodon instance, because
there's nothing but negativity

524
00:35:00,690 --> 00:35:05,430
that flows through from Jack
offs. It's like it. And I, I'm

525
00:35:05,430 --> 00:35:08,310
not quite sure what to do with
it don't want to curate it. I

526
00:35:08,310 --> 00:35:12,570
don't know. But I go there last.
But podcast index dot social is

527
00:35:12,570 --> 00:35:17,520
exciting. You know, there's not
a lot not too many people you

528
00:35:17,520 --> 00:35:21,330
know, it's like a small
community, which is what to me a

529
00:35:21,330 --> 00:35:25,440
podcast community is and I'd
love to just have, you know, for

530
00:35:25,440 --> 00:35:31,680
me the root posts of any social
interact tag that I fill out on

531
00:35:31,680 --> 00:35:34,410
my podcast, that's the community
there are people who listen to

532
00:35:34,410 --> 00:35:41,430
that episode. And, and I just
want to see that which is not

533
00:35:41,430 --> 00:35:45,210
available anywhere else into the
scale, we could implement it

534
00:35:45,390 --> 00:35:49,410
with all these extras. I want to
see I want to I want to Oh,

535
00:35:49,410 --> 00:35:52,110
there's Dave Jones. I want to
see what other podcasts he's

536
00:35:52,110 --> 00:35:55,530
listening to. Even though I'm on
podcast guru, and you're on

537
00:35:55,530 --> 00:36:00,840
Casta Matic This is discovery.
This is growing your show this

538
00:36:00,840 --> 00:36:02,970
is growing your penis, I mean,
all this stuff.

539
00:36:03,210 --> 00:36:04,830
Unknown: What did I say this the
ad pours?

540
00:36:06,690 --> 00:36:12,060
Adam Curry: Well, I'm throwing
the ads part in because the the

541
00:36:12,060 --> 00:36:17,010
marketing part. Because there's,
that's where you can reignite

542
00:36:17,010 --> 00:36:20,940
something and reignited around
our apps and take it away from

543
00:36:21,270 --> 00:36:24,480
the other so called I mean, it's
bull crap, it's all bull crap.

544
00:36:25,050 --> 00:36:28,500
But if if we start to build
value amongst each other, and

545
00:36:28,500 --> 00:36:31,590
amongst our apps will become
valuable.

546
00:36:33,510 --> 00:36:39,300
Dave Jones: This is a thing
that's hard for us, I think that

547
00:36:39,300 --> 00:36:42,270
we're running up against the
limits of language here. But I

548
00:36:42,270 --> 00:36:50,550
think that I fully follow what
you're saying. And I think I

549
00:36:50,550 --> 00:36:53,370
think I'm saying it that way,
because it's always difficult to

550
00:36:53,370 --> 00:36:57,630
tell because you have to, you
have to take a set of thoughts

551
00:36:57,630 --> 00:37:02,550
that are in your own mind and
distill them into language, and

552
00:37:02,550 --> 00:37:05,250
then community and then Trent,
you know, give them to me and I

553
00:37:05,250 --> 00:37:09,060
have to, you know, and distill
them yes, and try to mate and

554
00:37:09,060 --> 00:37:14,490
try to see if they make any
sense. In the some meaning is

555
00:37:14,490 --> 00:37:19,350
lost along every, every every
stop on that path. So think

556
00:37:19,350 --> 00:37:24,180
that, but I think that I follow
you. And I think the issue here

557
00:37:24,180 --> 00:37:31,170
is, is one of at some point, in
order to get past the idea that

558
00:37:31,290 --> 00:37:38,280
activity Pub is just an
alternative way to do a social

559
00:37:38,700 --> 00:37:45,060
network, then there has to be
this sort of, you can't just be

560
00:37:45,180 --> 00:37:48,360
you, it has to have that thought
almost has to be completely

561
00:37:48,360 --> 00:37:50,940
gone. You have to you have to
just there has to be this like

562
00:37:50,940 --> 00:37:58,320
complete Abnegation of the
entire, like, notion that

563
00:37:58,320 --> 00:38:03,060
activity Pub is a social network
at all. Correct? You know,

564
00:38:03,150 --> 00:38:09,300
because the like I hate you
know? So podcasting index does

565
00:38:09,300 --> 00:38:13,500
social. I'm glad you pressed on
this because this is this is

566
00:38:13,500 --> 00:38:16,380
actually bringing up some stuff
in my mind and helping me to

567
00:38:16,380 --> 00:38:19,500
understand some things. Podcasts
and digital social is an

568
00:38:19,500 --> 00:38:24,300
important thing. It's where the
community mostly lives in 2.0

569
00:38:24,300 --> 00:38:26,820
Things get hashed out and now
and all that we all know that

570
00:38:26,820 --> 00:38:36,030
but there's a sense in which I'm
happy there but sometimes

571
00:38:36,030 --> 00:38:39,900
happiness is your gateway to
annoy and happiness

572
00:38:39,900 --> 00:38:41,520
Adam Curry: is a warm gun. Dave
Jones.

573
00:38:42,420 --> 00:38:46,050
Dave Jones: Wow. Wow. Wow.

574
00:38:46,830 --> 00:38:48,450
Adam Curry: Sorry little John
Lennon reference. I'm

575
00:38:48,450 --> 00:38:54,510
Dave Jones: sorry. Okay. Okay. I
didn't get the reference. So the

576
00:38:55,290 --> 00:39:00,180
Yes, yeah. So that can Yeah, you
know, you happiness sometimes is

577
00:39:00,180 --> 00:39:05,760
your sort of gateway to being
annoyed. And the the, the

578
00:39:05,760 --> 00:39:10,530
annoying part is the commit is
this sort of endless

579
00:39:10,530 --> 00:39:15,030
communication that happens back
and forth. And I don't like the

580
00:39:15,030 --> 00:39:22,950
social aspect of it, if it feels
artificial. It feels like an

581
00:39:22,950 --> 00:39:27,420
obligation sometimes. And all of
those things and it's not

582
00:39:27,420 --> 00:39:30,870
anything unique to podcast index
dot social is probably better

583
00:39:30,870 --> 00:39:33,450
than any other community I've
ever been involved in on that

584
00:39:33,450 --> 00:39:37,650
aspect of things. But there is
an there is a certain level of

585
00:39:37,650 --> 00:39:44,220
that the students inherent with
social networking. And when you

586
00:39:44,220 --> 00:39:52,800
think about like, once you break
out of that thinking and say,

587
00:39:52,800 --> 00:39:57,930
okay, activity pub isn't about
social networking. It's about

588
00:39:59,580 --> 00:40:05,580
connect Acting sort of events.
It's an it's sort of an event

589
00:40:05,580 --> 00:40:14,130
connector, yes. Then you, then
you can start to move beyond the

590
00:40:14,130 --> 00:40:19,890
social network parts and the
annoyances that that brings, and

591
00:40:19,890 --> 00:40:23,010
get to something that's truly
new. And I feel like one of the

592
00:40:23,070 --> 00:40:29,190
like, as soon as one of these
truly new things occurs, as soon

593
00:40:29,190 --> 00:40:33,660
as something happens on activity
pub that is truly new. And I

594
00:40:33,660 --> 00:40:37,920
mean in relation to podcasting,
and is not just a comment

595
00:40:37,920 --> 00:40:43,140
engine, then it opens, it's
going to be like an eye opener,

596
00:40:43,290 --> 00:40:45,330
and it opens the doors. And then
there's going to be a flood of

597
00:40:45,330 --> 00:40:50,130
new of new activity that
happens, where people say, oh,

598
00:40:50,220 --> 00:40:57,150
oh, this is what you can do. You
could do things like x. And then

599
00:40:57,150 --> 00:41:00,210
you can, all of a sudden,
there'll be this like burst of

600
00:41:00,210 --> 00:41:03,690
activity that happens along down
that going down that road. Well,

601
00:41:03,690 --> 00:41:04,230
there's already

602
00:41:04,230 --> 00:41:09,150
Adam Curry: versions of this.
Fountain has their version of

603
00:41:09,150 --> 00:41:13,560
that, but they're completely
closed. You die can see what so

604
00:41:13,560 --> 00:41:17,520
and so boosted, I can see what
so that I can follow someone

605
00:41:17,520 --> 00:41:22,470
follow those profiles. It's the
number one app out of usage, I

606
00:41:22,470 --> 00:41:24,180
think for sure. To

607
00:41:24,180 --> 00:41:27,690
Dave Jones: see that still,
that's still a version of chat,

608
00:41:27,720 --> 00:41:29,700
that's still a version of just
commenting

609
00:41:29,700 --> 00:41:31,140
Adam Curry: I don't know. But
that's not what I'm interested

610
00:41:31,140 --> 00:41:33,690
in. What I'm interested in is
following a person for what

611
00:41:33,690 --> 00:41:38,880
they're listening to. That's the
thing that is if I could say one

612
00:41:38,880 --> 00:41:41,730
thing that we could do with
activity pub, it would be that

613
00:41:44,550 --> 00:41:50,040
you can, as a user, you can say,
Okay, here's, here's the, here's

614
00:41:50,040 --> 00:41:56,790
the podcast I'm subscribed to,
and anybody can follow me. It'd

615
00:41:56,790 --> 00:41:59,460
be something that I could
publish, you know, we've all had

616
00:41:59,460 --> 00:42:02,400
these, um, you know, automatic
posts, I'm listening to so and

617
00:42:02,400 --> 00:42:07,830
so. But I would like to follow
you to see, not only would I

618
00:42:07,830 --> 00:42:11,940
love it personally, to see what
podcasts you're following, or

619
00:42:11,940 --> 00:42:14,280
which ones you care to share
with me which you're following,

620
00:42:14,280 --> 00:42:16,170
because I believe that's
important that you know that

621
00:42:16,170 --> 00:42:20,550
some things you may not want me
to know. But even maybe I'd like

622
00:42:20,550 --> 00:42:25,500
to know when you're listening to
something. These are social

623
00:42:25,500 --> 00:42:28,710
things that have been proven
time and time to work very

624
00:42:28,710 --> 00:42:33,360
successfully. So if we take the
whole comment thing out, I don't

625
00:42:33,360 --> 00:42:38,520
care, I really don't care about
comments. I care about

626
00:42:38,520 --> 00:42:42,570
connecting our apps, because I
see, okay, this feels to me like

627
00:42:42,570 --> 00:42:46,920
2000 in 2000, I got on an
airplane, I flew to New York,

628
00:42:47,070 --> 00:42:51,210
and we went to Dave Weiner's
hotel room. And by stood there

629
00:42:51,210 --> 00:42:56,910
and I said, we need to have some
kind of attachment to a post on

630
00:42:56,910 --> 00:43:00,810
the RSS feed. And he thought it
was just an assholes Hollywood

631
00:43:00,810 --> 00:43:05,160
guy coming in to tell him what
to do. And then he basically

632
00:43:05,160 --> 00:43:08,670
threw me out. And I went back
the next day, and I went back a

633
00:43:08,670 --> 00:43:12,840
third time. But I try and I
tried to show him in his own

634
00:43:12,840 --> 00:43:17,010
software, what I was talking
about. And then it finally hit

635
00:43:17,010 --> 00:43:21,630
him. And that was the actual
birth of podcasting in 2000. And

636
00:43:21,630 --> 00:43:28,140
I feel the same way. I feel just
as strongly that this and

637
00:43:28,170 --> 00:43:30,870
believe me, the fact that I'm
getting this from Sam Sethi is

638
00:43:30,870 --> 00:43:35,280
blowing my mind. Because I was I
was like nah, Sam, I don't know

639
00:43:35,280 --> 00:43:37,440
what you're doing over there.
It's confusing. I don't get it.

640
00:43:37,770 --> 00:43:40,440
But then once he interviewed
that guy, I forget his name,

641
00:43:40,440 --> 00:43:43,980
who's the co author of the book
that's coming out. I was like,

642
00:43:44,040 --> 00:43:50,220
Okay, I get it. The everything.
I believe everything's going to

643
00:43:50,220 --> 00:43:54,060
be connected to activity pub one
way or the other. It's really an

644
00:43:54,090 --> 00:43:56,220
inter app sharing protocol.

645
00:43:57,840 --> 00:44:03,180
Dave Jones: Yeah. Yeah. And this
is, in this is, that's really

646
00:44:03,180 --> 00:44:09,330
what where the strength is. And
it's just been I was looking

647
00:44:09,330 --> 00:44:13,230
through this big list of
activity pub projects here in

648
00:44:13,230 --> 00:44:18,960
this link, and there's like 9%
of them are just Mastodon clones

649
00:44:19,050 --> 00:44:22,830
Adam Curry: at just as an
example. When so I have boosted

650
00:44:22,830 --> 00:44:28,020
Graham ball. I mean, man,
there's gotta be a way to have

651
00:44:28,050 --> 00:44:33,090
activity published activity pub,
published about first of all the

652
00:44:33,090 --> 00:44:37,380
songs that I'm playing. They
should be able to tie in easily

653
00:44:37,380 --> 00:44:41,340
to wherever that song lives
easily to that artists profile

654
00:44:41,370 --> 00:44:46,470
easily to where that artist
likes to meet their fans. So if

655
00:44:46,470 --> 00:44:50,940
artists wants to have that all
flow through to a chat or is

656
00:44:50,940 --> 00:44:53,610
this just called a chat,
whatever meeting place, close

657
00:44:53,610 --> 00:44:57,000
forum, I don't care what you
call it. All of that can be done

658
00:44:57,120 --> 00:45:00,840
seamlessly. Hey, you want to
know more about ain't Costello

659
00:45:01,890 --> 00:45:03,840
just tap on the on the art.

660
00:45:05,339 --> 00:45:07,739
Dave Jones: You're shuttled off
with Betsy. here's and here's

661
00:45:07,739 --> 00:45:13,139
what that looks like, though, is
because you could this is where

662
00:45:13,469 --> 00:45:21,269
I think this is important.
Rather than just post a note, so

663
00:45:21,269 --> 00:45:23,459
activity pub theory, your

664
00:45:25,380 --> 00:45:26,130
Adam Curry: show beer.

665
00:45:27,510 --> 00:45:32,430
Dave Jones: Right activity pubs
notes, are what get posted on.

666
00:45:32,670 --> 00:45:36,840
Like, when the act when the
podcast index AP bridge posts a

667
00:45:36,840 --> 00:45:42,330
new episode, you're getting a
you're creating a note is what

668
00:45:42,330 --> 00:45:50,430
the object is called. And you
rather than here's the critical

669
00:45:50,430 --> 00:45:54,270
part, I think is rather than
just posting a note that says

670
00:45:55,710 --> 00:45:59,520
This song was just played on
this grand ball, that is

671
00:45:59,520 --> 00:46:04,530
possible, but you also posed a
customer, it's a new type of

672
00:46:04,530 --> 00:46:10,020
object, you create a new type of
object. With that's more that's

673
00:46:10,020 --> 00:46:14,700
not just a text representation
of the thing. It's its own

674
00:46:14,700 --> 00:46:20,220
custom object here is a here is
a podcast episode four here is a

675
00:46:20,220 --> 00:46:27,600
remote item. These were bring
these these concepts of 2.0 into

676
00:46:27,600 --> 00:46:33,930
the activity pub world as native
objects. Yes. Yes. And then the

677
00:46:33,930 --> 00:46:37,470
other people are receiving them,
the other platforms are received

678
00:46:37,470 --> 00:46:42,540
them in their native format. And
then can choose to do lots of

679
00:46:42,540 --> 00:46:46,830
different things with them, pass
them on to an to a front end in

680
00:46:46,830 --> 00:46:51,660
a way that is like, Okay, so for
instance, pod, let's just let's

681
00:46:51,660 --> 00:47:00,570
just use pod versus example. Pod
verse, is, gets a gets a more in

682
00:47:00,570 --> 00:47:06,540
a more compliant with activity
pub on the backside. And it sees

683
00:47:07,650 --> 00:47:12,990
it's sees events happening, it's
getting events posted to it.

684
00:47:13,980 --> 00:47:21,480
From the booster, ground ball.
Activity pub, that, you know,

685
00:47:21,510 --> 00:47:25,050
spewer whatever that whatever
the word is the term Yes. Pure.

686
00:47:25,080 --> 00:47:30,270
Yes, this viewer. And then it's,
it's it's seeing these things

687
00:47:30,270 --> 00:47:36,750
come in, as events in in a sort
of native object format. And now

688
00:47:36,750 --> 00:47:42,600
it doesn't have to have this
live stream switcher. WebSocket.

689
00:47:43,380 --> 00:47:43,680
Yeah,

690
00:47:44,100 --> 00:47:47,370
Adam Curry: there's a perfect
example. Perfect example. Yes.

691
00:47:47,910 --> 00:47:50,010
Dave Jones: Which has been
problematic, it's hard. It's a

692
00:47:50,010 --> 00:47:54,450
hard. This is not that people
have struggled with with

693
00:47:54,450 --> 00:47:57,930
connecting to this web to the
live web socket to see the split

694
00:47:57,930 --> 00:48:03,480
kit changes. So a split kid is
outputting activity pub. And

695
00:48:03,510 --> 00:48:08,430
then the split kit actor, for
booster grand ball can just be

696
00:48:08,430 --> 00:48:12,930
subscribed to or followed,
excuse me. And then those those

697
00:48:12,930 --> 00:48:17,400
split kid events can be
multiplexed in a way that they

698
00:48:17,400 --> 00:48:22,620
can't easily in a or at all in a
in a single WebSocket

699
00:48:22,620 --> 00:48:23,250
connection.

700
00:48:24,120 --> 00:48:29,340
Adam Curry: And think of all the
richness of the data. Pod roles.

701
00:48:30,840 --> 00:48:34,110
I mean, all of this can, you can
just traverse the tree,

702
00:48:34,110 --> 00:48:39,240
basically, whatever that event
is, whatever that podcast event

703
00:48:39,240 --> 00:48:43,020
is into activity, pub. There's
all kinds of stuff that can be

704
00:48:43,020 --> 00:48:48,360
done with that by other apps.
And you can you can, you know,

705
00:48:48,690 --> 00:48:52,290
to me just as a non app
developer, it's like, oh, look

706
00:48:52,290 --> 00:48:55,500
at all this data that I can use,
I can surface somewhere instead

707
00:48:55,500 --> 00:48:58,440
of kind of the things that we've
had for the past 20 years with

708
00:48:58,440 --> 00:49:02,550
the exception of the new tags we
have, which is great. And people

709
00:49:02,550 --> 00:49:06,450
love new tags that put new stuff
in. But now I want to be able to

710
00:49:06,450 --> 00:49:10,680
populate other things. And this
is where we're, we can bring in

711
00:49:10,920 --> 00:49:16,680
the user, the listener, the
audience, community, things that

712
00:49:16,680 --> 00:49:19,920
they're doing that they want to
share as a part of it back to

713
00:49:19,920 --> 00:49:23,280
the back to the podcast back to
that community. But also,

714
00:49:23,400 --> 00:49:26,160
everything's a Venn diagram. I
know sound like Kamla Harris,

715
00:49:26,160 --> 00:49:30,360
but everything is event Venn
diagram between podcasts shows,

716
00:49:30,630 --> 00:49:35,520
things overlap, people overlap,
you can do, I think amazing

717
00:49:35,520 --> 00:49:41,490
things through this app
interconnector. And yeah, I

718
00:49:41,550 --> 00:49:47,220
totally think it should be its
own type of spewer element,

719
00:49:47,220 --> 00:49:50,610
whatever it is something that
maybe it's even unique to, that

720
00:49:50,610 --> 00:49:54,180
we put into activity pub, like,
Oh, this is, this is what you

721
00:49:54,180 --> 00:49:58,530
can access from a podcast app.
This is the kind of stuff that

722
00:49:58,530 --> 00:50:03,750
can broadcast into or activity
pub to be picked up by whatever

723
00:50:05,730 --> 00:50:11,010
Dave Jones: it sort of but this
is a good follow up to our, to

724
00:50:11,010 --> 00:50:13,410
the insanity, which was last
week's boardroom?

725
00:50:14,519 --> 00:50:17,759
Adam Curry: Well, yes, perfect
example. Yes.

726
00:50:18,629 --> 00:50:22,829
Dave Jones: Because what what
Bouverie does on a consistent

727
00:50:22,829 --> 00:50:29,759
basis is similar to that, that
old thing that we saw where you

728
00:50:29,759 --> 00:50:34,949
would go to a website and had a
live like webcam video of some

729
00:50:34,949 --> 00:50:41,099
goats? Yes, you could be Yeah,
he could send some and send some

730
00:50:41,099 --> 00:50:44,669
bitcoin to a specific address
and it would shoot some goat

731
00:50:44,669 --> 00:50:49,169
food out of the out of the
nozzle and the goats run over

732
00:50:49,169 --> 00:50:52,769
there and grab some food that
which was endlessly

733
00:50:52,769 --> 00:50:57,479
entertaining, and, and sort of
like blew blew your mind on this

734
00:50:57,479 --> 00:51:00,989
level of like, I can't believe
this is real, like I'm sending

735
00:51:00,989 --> 00:51:05,189
Bitcoin to this address. And
then goats are running around

736
00:51:05,219 --> 00:51:09,509
eating because of it. It's like
so weird. Yeah. And so once you

737
00:51:09,539 --> 00:51:12,299
and that's the blueberry does
that stuff all the time with

738
00:51:12,299 --> 00:51:15,929
these weird little projects that
he cooks up? I think this helps

739
00:51:15,929 --> 00:51:21,479
stretch you out of this helps
you stress you out of this

740
00:51:21,479 --> 00:51:25,619
mindset. That the thing that
you're dealing with the protocol

741
00:51:25,619 --> 00:51:28,619
you're dealing with is only for
this one thing. Yes.

742
00:51:29,940 --> 00:51:33,360
Adam Curry: That's the vision
that is exactly the vision

743
00:51:34,050 --> 00:51:34,560
antenna

744
00:51:34,560 --> 00:51:40,800
Dave Jones: pod, which is a
great FOSS application, podcast

745
00:51:40,800 --> 00:51:45,990
app that we don't talk enough
about antenna pod had a call for

746
00:51:45,990 --> 00:51:51,330
contributors this week for 2.0
features like cross app comments

747
00:51:51,330 --> 00:51:54,630
and stuff like that they want
people open source developers to

748
00:51:54,630 --> 00:52:00,510
help contribute 2.0 features to
antenna BOD and this is this is

749
00:52:00,510 --> 00:52:04,890
a perfect opportunity for for
them to add some are for for

750
00:52:04,890 --> 00:52:06,990
contributors to add stuff like
that in

751
00:52:07,260 --> 00:52:09,870
Adam Curry: yeah and I would
just say social interact that I

752
00:52:09,870 --> 00:52:14,070
think cross app comments is
death. The name is Death is just

753
00:52:14,070 --> 00:52:14,460
down

754
00:52:14,490 --> 00:52:18,390
Dave Jones: the years death is
death. That's a good point.

755
00:52:18,570 --> 00:52:19,230
Social

756
00:52:19,260 --> 00:52:22,470
Adam Curry: interact. That's the
name of the tag is called Social

757
00:52:22,470 --> 00:52:23,190
interact.

758
00:52:23,940 --> 00:52:27,180
Dave Jones: Thank God we didn't
call it comment. Ah, worst word

759
00:52:27,180 --> 00:52:29,910
Adam Curry: that would have been
the worst. Yes. So that's my

760
00:52:29,910 --> 00:52:40,980
pitch it just seems that this is
we have a band and orchestra of

761
00:52:40,980 --> 00:52:45,180
very interesting people you
know, people bring all their own

762
00:52:45,180 --> 00:52:49,380
instruments we've got a guy with
a washboard someone's playing

763
00:52:49,380 --> 00:52:53,580
spoons, we got a banjo we got
five and drove on the Joe I've

764
00:52:53,580 --> 00:52:59,790
drummers jug. Exactly. And I'd
love to make the music all play

765
00:52:59,790 --> 00:53:04,380
together. Because we're via
we're now into Phase seven,

766
00:53:04,410 --> 00:53:09,090
we're doing tags. And you know,
a lot of them are not

767
00:53:09,090 --> 00:53:13,890
implemented or kind of
implemented. Creating some form

768
00:53:13,890 --> 00:53:18,750
of, of architecture around the
social interact tag, which is

769
00:53:18,750 --> 00:53:23,160
nothing more than just here's
here's a root level item that,

770
00:53:23,580 --> 00:53:31,890
that a podcast app through its
users can start adding stuff to

771
00:53:32,520 --> 00:53:38,850
that can be shared out to the
world, whether that's another

772
00:53:38,850 --> 00:53:45,510
app, whether it's to you know,
it can be a completely it can be

773
00:53:45,510 --> 00:53:48,120
completely it could be a
Microsoft Word for all I care.

774
00:53:48,150 --> 00:53:53,340
It can be anything that's the
beauty of it. You know, to like

775
00:53:53,340 --> 00:53:57,300
blueberries, I mean, we have all
these cool things like you know,

776
00:53:57,300 --> 00:54:02,910
the the the IRC bot that fires
off that no one else knows how

777
00:54:02,910 --> 00:54:08,040
to use you know that only works
in one in one particular way you

778
00:54:08,040 --> 00:54:11,160
know, he's got him basically
what you said he's got stuff

779
00:54:11,310 --> 00:54:15,090
light lights going on. I mean,
maybe I want to like to go on

780
00:54:15,090 --> 00:54:18,600
when my favorite podcast to post
something or whatever in my own

781
00:54:18,600 --> 00:54:18,900
house. I

782
00:54:18,900 --> 00:54:20,760
Dave Jones: mean, it goes live
Yeah,

783
00:54:20,790 --> 00:54:23,760
Adam Curry: I mean, start my
vacuum cleaner. I don't know. I

784
00:54:23,760 --> 00:54:27,780
mean, it can can be anything I'm
just saying that I see I'm from

785
00:54:27,780 --> 00:54:33,000
the future. I see social
interact in activity pub as

786
00:54:33,000 --> 00:54:38,370
something huge. Really, really
big. This something I believe

787
00:54:38,400 --> 00:54:39,960
even Marco could get in on

788
00:54:42,360 --> 00:54:47,490
Dave Jones: Yeah. Yeah, there
already do. We need to Enough

789
00:54:47,490 --> 00:54:50,910
talk to Alex about bridging pod
ping over to activity pub before

790
00:54:50,910 --> 00:54:55,530
too and that that seems like an
important thing to me. I don't

791
00:54:55,530 --> 00:54:56,850
know if you

792
00:54:56,850 --> 00:54:59,070
Adam Curry: don't we basically
have that already. We have we

793
00:54:59,070 --> 00:55:02,220
have the live The Live account
that just pops up, he's talking

794
00:55:02,220 --> 00:55:04,230
about something else. I'm just

795
00:55:04,230 --> 00:55:06,600
Dave Jones: talking about in
general. So they put things. So

796
00:55:06,600 --> 00:55:09,480
the pod pings sort of cross
pollinate over to activity posts

797
00:55:09,480 --> 00:55:12,240
so that you can follow. I mean,
I'm just an act, you know,

798
00:55:12,390 --> 00:55:16,080
Adam Curry: I'm still looking
for me as an app user, I want to

799
00:55:16,080 --> 00:55:19,410
do something on this app that
publishes some events somewhere.

800
00:55:21,270 --> 00:55:23,700
That's what I want. It doesn't
have to be a comment. That's,

801
00:55:23,700 --> 00:55:28,230
that's the lowest level
shittiest fruit tastes bad is

802
00:55:28,230 --> 00:55:32,340
usually bad as whatever. That's
the lowest. Yeah,

803
00:55:32,340 --> 00:55:34,920
Dave Jones: I think that's
probably what's also kept people

804
00:55:35,040 --> 00:55:37,890
as they can people. I mean,
developers think that's probably

805
00:55:37,890 --> 00:55:43,320
what's also kept 2.0 developers
from doing more with the social

806
00:55:43,320 --> 00:55:46,770
interact tag is because it's
like, comments. That's kind of

807
00:55:46,770 --> 00:55:47,340
boring.

808
00:55:47,640 --> 00:55:49,470
Adam Curry: Yeah. Or, or a pain
in the butt.

809
00:55:50,820 --> 00:55:54,660
Dave Jones: But like, it's, it's
just not. It's just, I think

810
00:55:54,660 --> 00:55:59,010
everybody's, there's a general
Oh, people are just over it. So

811
00:55:59,010 --> 00:56:00,840
with social media, sure,

812
00:56:00,870 --> 00:56:05,160
Adam Curry: sure. I'm completely
understand. I just, I don't see

813
00:56:05,220 --> 00:56:12,390
20 apps, I see an entire
connected infrastructure, that

814
00:56:12,390 --> 00:56:19,050
can be something much bigger. By
communicating inter app. The

815
00:56:19,050 --> 00:56:26,550
simplest things, follow the
subscribe, rate, even those who

816
00:56:26,550 --> 00:56:28,170
just start with those two, just
those

817
00:56:28,170 --> 00:56:31,470
Dave Jones: gentlemen about what
Amanda pod pings being bridged

818
00:56:31,470 --> 00:56:35,910
is that if you had pod pings
coming through as Nick, coming

819
00:56:35,910 --> 00:56:41,010
through his native activity pub
objects, then you could just say

820
00:56:41,010 --> 00:56:49,170
like, you could subscribe, or
excuse me, Fox, keep saying the

821
00:56:49,170 --> 00:56:55,500
word subscribe. I mean, follow.
You could follow a podcast

822
00:56:55,530 --> 00:57:02,310
actor. And then just, excuse me,
you could follow you could

823
00:57:02,310 --> 00:57:07,380
follow some sort of actor that
represents your podcast

824
00:57:07,380 --> 00:57:13,800
playlist. And then then you can
just follow that like, Okay,

825
00:57:14,670 --> 00:57:18,900
think Okay, think about this
hypothetical app. Now let's use

826
00:57:18,900 --> 00:57:26,550
intent upon Okay, antenna
antenna pod, at some future date

827
00:57:26,580 --> 00:57:30,720
understands, in this
hypothetical world understands

828
00:57:30,720 --> 00:57:38,490
activity pub on the back end. So
then you have a or on the low

829
00:57:38,490 --> 00:57:43,620
level you, you fire up antenna
pod and you follow your playlist

830
00:57:44,370 --> 00:57:51,210
as an actor, then, this playlist
actor also knows. So this

831
00:57:51,210 --> 00:57:56,310
playlist actor is is a
representation of all of the

832
00:57:56,310 --> 00:58:04,140
podcasts you follow. And then as
these pod pings come in, the

833
00:58:04,500 --> 00:58:13,470
playlist actor their sort of
activity stream is showing these

834
00:58:13,470 --> 00:58:17,730
events, these pod pings coming
in as activity pub objects. And

835
00:58:17,730 --> 00:58:21,390
your and your app, just gets
them and knows where new

836
00:58:21,390 --> 00:58:26,130
episodes are. So your app and
gets episodes within within 60

837
00:58:26,130 --> 00:58:32,190
seconds. Just by virtue of you
being Have you following the

838
00:58:32,190 --> 00:58:33,750
playlist actor? Okay,

839
00:58:33,750 --> 00:58:36,510
Adam Curry: so what you're Oh,
interesting. So what if I'm

840
00:58:36,510 --> 00:58:39,450
following you what you're saying
is this could be a great benefit

841
00:58:39,450 --> 00:58:43,740
to developers, because now you
have a different alert mechanism

842
00:58:44,430 --> 00:58:47,400
that is probably more
responsive, more robust than

843
00:58:47,430 --> 00:58:50,490
almost anything else that
polling. Right.

844
00:58:50,490 --> 00:58:56,190
Dave Jones: So what happened?
Yes. So what happens now is So

845
00:58:56,190 --> 00:58:59,340
what happens now is things you
think about so cast ematic is

846
00:58:59,340 --> 00:59:02,820
good example. I think I think
cast Matic I think antenna

847
00:59:02,820 --> 00:59:06,420
podcast thematic are similar in
that they do not have back end

848
00:59:06,450 --> 00:59:09,720
infrastructure. I think they are
standalone apps. Everything

849
00:59:09,720 --> 00:59:18,210
happens on device on one device,
right? So imagine that so the

850
00:59:18,210 --> 00:59:21,210
way it works now, let me back up
the way it works. Now is that

851
00:59:21,630 --> 00:59:27,300
something like hasta Matic you
have a list of feeds and cast

852
00:59:27,300 --> 00:59:32,280
ematic poles those feeds
periodically to find out is

853
00:59:32,280 --> 00:59:38,070
there's new episodes Yes. In
this playlist actor scenario,

854
00:59:38,490 --> 00:59:42,060
you have a an activity pub
actor, and that could be your

855
00:59:42,060 --> 00:59:44,070
normal activity pub account.

856
00:59:44,880 --> 00:59:45,360
Adam Curry: Yes,

857
00:59:45,570 --> 00:59:47,850
Dave Jones: that's true. That
could just Dave at podcasts and

858
00:59:47,850 --> 00:59:54,660
desktop social. And this this
account also follows all these

859
00:59:54,660 --> 01:00:00,780
podcasts. But instead of coming
through as text items as notes,

860
01:00:01,620 --> 01:00:04,500
they also come through as
something like a pod ping

861
01:00:04,500 --> 01:00:14,460
object. So that when, when cast
ematic is canoe is, is following

862
01:00:14,460 --> 01:00:20,460
your account, they get these pod
pings, do they see the poppings

863
01:00:20,730 --> 01:00:26,520
Ping objects as they come in in
the timeline. And it's just

864
01:00:26,640 --> 01:00:29,940
receiving these notifications,
essentially, that there's a new

865
01:00:29,940 --> 01:00:31,320
episode available. This

866
01:00:31,320 --> 01:00:33,780
Adam Curry: is what I like about
this conversation, because this

867
01:00:33,780 --> 01:00:38,820
is how this is the creativity of
developers. That you will come

868
01:00:38,820 --> 01:00:42,240
up view and others will come up
with ideas that will not be

869
01:00:42,240 --> 01:00:47,910
baked up by me. You know, there
will be new ideas that pop out

870
01:00:47,910 --> 01:00:52,140
of this once once we make those
connections. And again, so

871
01:00:52,140 --> 01:00:56,010
that's still not really
interacting between communities,

872
01:00:56,010 --> 01:01:00,480
but it's a start, there will be
a start to get to get activity

873
01:01:00,480 --> 01:01:06,660
pub connected to the apps. But
I'm still much more interested

874
01:01:06,690 --> 01:01:12,900
in what can I do just by simply
using my app that helps me share

875
01:01:12,900 --> 01:01:16,110
with the community of people who
are listening to that podcast,

876
01:01:16,500 --> 01:01:20,550
or a community of people that
happened to listen to the same

877
01:01:20,550 --> 01:01:27,090
podcasts. And that doesn't mean
comments. Just show me you know,

878
01:01:27,090 --> 01:01:33,060
sir. Oh, you know, five of the
people in, in in this community

879
01:01:33,060 --> 01:01:40,260
of this podcast also listened to
Dundar dot c now you're helping

880
01:01:40,260 --> 01:01:44,100
Discovery now you're helping
grow your show. But you're also

881
01:01:44,130 --> 01:01:47,640
giving me some benefit. Oh,
that's interesting. Now can I

882
01:01:47,670 --> 01:01:51,270
can I ping that person? And can
I see what when I say Ping i Can

883
01:01:51,270 --> 01:01:54,660
I take a look at what what their
subs? This is like Napster.

884
01:01:54,690 --> 01:01:57,960
Napster was the same thing you
looked for. He looked for a

885
01:01:57,960 --> 01:02:00,810
song. Oh, I found this woman
will reroute around this guy's

886
01:02:00,810 --> 01:02:02,400
drive. What else is he got
there?

887
01:02:03,210 --> 01:02:06,060
Dave Jones: Remember? Yeah,
yeah, yeah, that was the best

888
01:02:06,060 --> 01:02:06,600
part. And

889
01:02:06,600 --> 01:02:08,370
Adam Curry: that wasn't a
publisher. That was just some

890
01:02:08,370 --> 01:02:13,200
rando dude who had Napster
running? That was so cool. Yeah.

891
01:02:13,260 --> 01:02:16,830
Then you'd actually you'd work
with people and we connect. Hey,

892
01:02:16,830 --> 01:02:19,470
man, I'm downloading now. Can
you hold off for a second so I

893
01:02:19,470 --> 01:02:22,980
can get my songs faster? I mean,
it was it was it was a real

894
01:02:22,980 --> 01:02:28,740
community based thing. You
really was. Without that?

895
01:02:29,760 --> 01:02:32,970
Dave Jones: Without Yeah, yeah.
And that Napster would have. If

896
01:02:32,970 --> 01:02:34,560
it had had chat, it would have

897
01:02:34,620 --> 01:02:37,050
Adam Curry: it would have killed
it probably had destroyed it.

898
01:02:37,080 --> 01:02:37,800
Yeah. Yeah.

899
01:02:38,310 --> 01:02:43,380
Dave Jones: That's, that's the
Yeah, the non textual non chat

900
01:02:44,160 --> 01:02:48,150
aspect of activity. Pub is what
we need to leverage in 2.0. And

901
01:02:48,150 --> 01:02:52,110
make, yeah, make us make a first
class citizen of

902
01:02:52,140 --> 01:02:56,250
Adam Curry: Yes. And make the
user make the user be the

903
01:02:56,250 --> 01:03:00,390
communicator and the receiver,
not just the podcast publisher.

904
01:03:01,440 --> 01:03:05,040
Yeah, give that user something
to do. Give that user something

905
01:03:05,040 --> 01:03:11,370
to discover. I mean, that pod
ping is pod. Pod roll is kind of

906
01:03:11,370 --> 01:03:16,500
the beginning of that, but it's
still coming from. Okay. You

907
01:03:16,500 --> 01:03:18,960
like this? This show? Here's
what here's what else we

908
01:03:18,960 --> 01:03:22,980
recommend. Button. I'm telling
the most exciting thing is when

909
01:03:22,980 --> 01:03:27,990
I get it like you post I mean,
okay, bad example may be but you

910
01:03:27,990 --> 01:03:33,120
post something from Chesterton
on the social which is you know,

911
01:03:33,660 --> 01:03:36,570
just because you posted it
doesn't mean that I couldn't be

912
01:03:37,410 --> 01:03:40,800
following you for your your
audio book feed like, Oh, he's

913
01:03:40,830 --> 01:03:44,010
he's listening to an audio book
of Chesterton. I want to listen

914
01:03:44,010 --> 01:03:49,800
to that too. Now. Yeah, that's
how it works. Working out in pod

915
01:03:49,800 --> 01:03:55,710
verse you made a clip you know,
can people follow my clips?

916
01:03:56,580 --> 01:03:59,460
Dave Jones: Yeah, a clip should
be an actor. Yes. Yes.

917
01:03:59,790 --> 01:04:03,060
Adam Curry: And follow up follow
the clips I made that what who

918
01:04:03,060 --> 01:04:07,140
else listen to this clip. Where
did it go? That

919
01:04:07,170 --> 01:04:12,060
Dave Jones: that's probably the
best sort of inroad into this in

920
01:04:12,060 --> 01:04:18,300
as far as mental framework goes
is what what thing is what would

921
01:04:18,300 --> 01:04:23,130
happen if everything consider
what the world would look like?

922
01:04:23,670 --> 01:04:29,040
If the thing you're talking
about was itself an actor? What

923
01:04:29,040 --> 01:04:31,800
if the episode was an actor
would if the US listener was an

924
01:04:31,800 --> 01:04:35,610
actor with a podcaster?
Everything's the world is the

925
01:04:35,610 --> 01:04:38,040
clip the transcript Yeah,

926
01:04:38,070 --> 01:04:41,490
Adam Curry: transcript and great
idea could be an actor totally.

927
01:04:42,810 --> 01:04:44,700
Dave Jones: The world the
world's an instance and we're

928
01:04:44,700 --> 01:04:48,300
merely actors, you know, that
that's if everything it just

929
01:04:48,330 --> 01:04:53,880
think of the weirdest thing
about the, the smallest like

930
01:04:53,880 --> 01:04:58,890
node in your in your, in your
idea in which what if that was

931
01:04:58,890 --> 01:05:02,790
the actor That's where things
get kind of weird and beautiful.

932
01:05:04,740 --> 01:05:07,470
that's out there. This I think
is cool, man.

933
01:05:09,210 --> 01:05:12,270
Adam Curry: I think it's great.
I mean, should can't even be if

934
01:05:12,270 --> 01:05:16,260
you think about it. I can't even
each chapter be an actor.

935
01:05:16,890 --> 01:05:20,430
Potentially. Yeah, that's what
you can interact with this with

936
01:05:20,430 --> 01:05:22,020
the chapter by itself.

937
01:05:22,590 --> 01:05:26,730
Dave Jones: Yeah, yeah. Yeah.
It's got chapter art. So there's

938
01:05:26,730 --> 01:05:29,550
your avatar. Yeah, it's good.
It's

939
01:05:29,550 --> 01:05:30,630
Adam Curry: alive. Yes.

940
01:05:32,730 --> 01:05:35,790
Dave Jones: Like there's he
could do. That's where things

941
01:05:35,790 --> 01:05:38,310
get interesting is when you
start to think about non humans

942
01:05:38,310 --> 01:05:39,120
as actors.

943
01:05:40,080 --> 01:05:42,780
Adam Curry: So we just decide we
banned comments for now.

944
01:05:43,530 --> 01:05:46,170
Dave Jones: Yeah, comments off
the table. Comments are banned.

945
01:05:47,580 --> 01:05:50,010
Adam Curry: Good. I like it. I'm
excited now officially,

946
01:05:50,070 --> 01:05:51,630
officially, no comments.

947
01:05:52,920 --> 01:05:53,640
Dave Jones: No comment.

948
01:05:53,850 --> 01:05:56,340
Adam Curry: And you know, I'm
feeling people like Andrew

949
01:05:56,340 --> 01:05:59,580
grommet. You know, these are
people are going to start

950
01:05:59,640 --> 01:06:03,390
messing around with this.
Because they're, they're curious

951
01:06:03,390 --> 01:06:04,290
and creative.

952
01:06:08,520 --> 01:06:12,180
Dave Jones: We need we need to
do some namespace talk. Well,

953
01:06:12,210 --> 01:06:16,560
Adam Curry: just so happens, I
have. Where's my, oh, here we

954
01:06:16,560 --> 01:06:24,330
go. And now it's time for some
hot namespace talk. Jennifer had

955
01:06:24,330 --> 01:06:27,600
some kind of meltdown. So she
wasn't able to get our new

956
01:06:27,600 --> 01:06:33,480
jingles. But actually, yes, she
posted some picture and I was

957
01:06:33,480 --> 01:06:36,090
like, what is that? That doesn't
look good. I was like, Are you

958
01:06:36,090 --> 01:06:39,990
being electrocuted right now?
Um, I guess she has some kind of

959
01:06:39,990 --> 01:06:43,830
hum in the machine. So if you
need help, damn, Jennifer, let

960
01:06:43,830 --> 01:06:45,300
us know. I'll jump in.

961
01:06:46,050 --> 01:06:53,850
Dave Jones: So the publisher
feeds is we have we have two as

962
01:06:53,850 --> 01:07:01,530
a reminder, as a reminder, phase
seven ends on is closes on June

963
01:07:01,530 --> 01:07:06,840
the first so we're, we're
getting there. You know, we got

964
01:07:06,840 --> 01:07:11,160
about a month and a half to go
before we're going to shut down

965
01:07:11,160 --> 01:07:16,050
phase seven and start digging
through the digging through the

966
01:07:16,050 --> 01:07:19,200
flotsam and figuring out what
goes and you know what, in what

967
01:07:19,200 --> 01:07:25,350
stays pumped. So there's two
clear things that people need in

968
01:07:25,350 --> 01:07:28,680
as comm that is part that is
bubbled up very quickly. The

969
01:07:28,680 --> 01:07:34,380
publisher feeds, and some sort
of category tagging a genre,

970
01:07:35,040 --> 01:07:40,200
tags genre category, call it
what you will. And as a

971
01:07:40,200 --> 01:07:46,950
publisher feeds. Or a probably
it was probably we probably need

972
01:07:46,950 --> 01:07:50,640
to talk about tagging con
category genre next week.

973
01:07:51,720 --> 01:07:55,590
Because Sam, Seth is going to be
on the show we're going to do is

974
01:07:55,590 --> 01:07:59,730
we'll be diving into some of the
stuff but publisher feeds.

975
01:08:00,930 --> 01:08:05,280
There's one real I think we got
it pretty much baked, except

976
01:08:05,280 --> 01:08:12,210
that there's kind of one thing
that is a decision we have to

977
01:08:12,210 --> 01:08:17,370
make. And that's whether or not
we wrap the remote item in a

978
01:08:17,370 --> 01:08:24,090
publisher parent tag. Do you if
am I am I free to dive into

979
01:08:24,090 --> 01:08:28,710
this? Or do you need a primer on
where exactly we're at with this

980
01:08:28,710 --> 01:08:29,160
stuff?

981
01:08:30,570 --> 01:08:33,000
Adam Curry: If if you think I
need one then we probably all

982
01:08:33,000 --> 01:08:33,600
need one.

983
01:08:34,560 --> 01:08:37,170
Dave Jones: I don't know. You
may be you may be fully uh, you

984
01:08:37,170 --> 01:08:41,010
may be fully engaged and up to
date on this. I don't know. But

985
01:08:41,280 --> 01:08:46,080
if so that the idea just run
it's worth running up. Yeah, I

986
01:08:46,080 --> 01:08:52,440
think so. Yeah. Okay. So the
idea here is that you have you

987
01:08:52,470 --> 01:08:56,220
want to have this idea of a
publisher where don't get too

988
01:08:56,220 --> 01:08:59,340
hung up on the name publisher is
just an it's just a name names

989
01:08:59,340 --> 01:09:04,230
are not that big of a deal. So
publisher fee I'm sorry, Daniel.

990
01:09:04,770 --> 01:09:13,050
Publisher feeds are this concept
of having the the entity that

991
01:09:13,050 --> 01:09:20,910
creates a feed or a set of feeds
has their own feed. So let's

992
01:09:20,910 --> 01:09:26,010
just use you we have Adam curry
as the publisher and Adam curry

993
01:09:26,010 --> 01:09:33,990
publishes quote unquote for
feeds no agenda, podcasts into

994
01:09:33,990 --> 01:09:39,690
boy no. Korean the keeper. Mo
facts five feeds Yeah, boost

995
01:09:39,690 --> 01:09:40,680
scramble. Yep.

996
01:09:41,040 --> 01:09:44,130
Adam Curry: I've all the crap I
need to do more podcasts. You

997
01:09:44,130 --> 01:09:48,420
Dave Jones: need more pa you
don't have so you have you

998
01:09:48,420 --> 01:09:52,350
publish five you Adam curry as
the publisher published five

999
01:09:52,980 --> 01:10:00,570
podcast feeds. You need your own
feed. That read For instance,

1000
01:10:00,570 --> 01:10:05,370
those five feeds. And that's in
that feed that feed that

1001
01:10:05,370 --> 01:10:07,590
references, all your feeds is
going to be called the publisher

1002
01:10:07,590 --> 01:10:15,120
feed. And that is a way that
people can subscribe or follow

1003
01:10:15,150 --> 01:10:19,380
or somehow connect with all of
your feeds in a centralized

1004
01:10:19,380 --> 01:10:27,390
fashion, so that they know
canonically that these are all

1005
01:10:27,390 --> 01:10:30,060
the things that you published,
because you're the one saying

1006
01:10:30,060 --> 01:10:35,280
that that's true. If I know that
you're this is very similar to

1007
01:10:35,280 --> 01:10:38,070
what we used to have with a
freedom controller with s OPML.

1008
01:10:38,070 --> 01:10:38,340
Yeah,

1009
01:10:38,340 --> 01:10:42,720
Adam Curry: I was just gonna say
sounds OPML ish. Yeah, so in

1010
01:10:42,720 --> 01:10:45,390
Dave Jones: the freedom patrol,
we had an OPML in our XML

1011
01:10:45,390 --> 01:10:52,290
namespace for the OPML.
document. And we had this idea

1012
01:10:52,320 --> 01:10:57,690
of a disposition attribute. So
on each outline node, in the

1013
01:10:57,690 --> 01:11:02,160
XML, there was a thing called
disposition equals. And the two

1014
01:11:02,160 --> 01:11:09,240
possible values were pub or sub,
right. And so if I have a single

1015
01:11:09,240 --> 01:11:15,660
OPML document that represents
me, this is Dave's OPML. Dog,

1016
01:11:15,660 --> 01:11:21,840
and we call it your OPML. social
graph. Then, you could look at

1017
01:11:21,840 --> 01:11:25,200
that OPML document and say,
okay, everything with

1018
01:11:25,200 --> 01:11:30,450
disposition Pub is a feed that I
publish, everything with a

1019
01:11:30,450 --> 01:11:33,360
disposition sub is a feed that I
subscribe to,

1020
01:11:33,390 --> 01:11:36,870
Adam Curry: right, I think we
call it S OPML. Yeah, social

1021
01:11:36,870 --> 01:11:37,320
OPML.

1022
01:11:37,770 --> 01:11:41,310
Dave Jones: Right. So that was
the SOP ml namespace, this is

1023
01:11:41,310 --> 01:11:45,450
very similar. So you would have,
except you're leaving out the

1024
01:11:45,450 --> 01:11:50,790
sub part, you're just saying,
Okay, I have a RSS feed. And in

1025
01:11:50,790 --> 01:11:55,560
that feed, I'm going to list all
of the RSS feeds that I publish.

1026
01:11:57,090 --> 01:12:04,260
And so then in the to, to sort
of complete the loop there. On

1027
01:12:04,260 --> 01:12:07,140
those feeds that are being
referenced to those five Adam

1028
01:12:07,140 --> 01:12:12,900
curry feeds. You also put in a
link back to the publisher feed.

1029
01:12:13,500 --> 01:12:17,250
That way, if I'm subscribed to
Yeah, yeah, if I'm subscribed to

1030
01:12:17,250 --> 01:12:24,720
curry in the keeper, then my app
could also suggest if in a

1031
01:12:24,720 --> 01:12:29,880
special section or some handling
in the UI, could also say, Hey,

1032
01:12:30,240 --> 01:12:37,290
here's the other podcasts that
this publisher also creates in

1033
01:12:37,290 --> 01:12:39,450
Boca and it would know that
because they could see the

1034
01:12:39,450 --> 01:12:43,470
reference to the publisher feed,
walk back up the chain, to the

1035
01:12:43,470 --> 01:12:47,640
publisher feed, get those other
feeds and go parse them and

1036
01:12:47,640 --> 01:12:53,070
display them to the listener.
And so that's that's the idea.

1037
01:12:53,070 --> 01:12:56,850
You have this sort of two way
verification that happens. And

1038
01:12:56,850 --> 01:13:00,600
we've all this is all this is,
is pretty much fleshed out the

1039
01:13:00,600 --> 01:13:08,280
publisher feed. Just has remote
item links, linking to the

1040
01:13:08,280 --> 01:13:13,530
different feeds that the
publisher publishes. Yes, and

1041
01:13:13,530 --> 01:13:17,010
thank you who is the most read?
So let's the most relevant

1042
01:13:17,040 --> 01:13:23,430
aspect here is at the moment is
for music. So Ainsley Costello

1043
01:13:24,030 --> 01:13:30,690
has a publisher feed that has
all of her feeds that she

1044
01:13:30,690 --> 01:13:33,390
publishes, whether they're
singles or albums or whatever.

1045
01:13:33,900 --> 01:13:37,890
Those are all referenced within
that publisher feeds so you can

1046
01:13:37,890 --> 01:13:43,260
follow Ainsley. Or you can. You
can either follow the publisher

1047
01:13:43,260 --> 01:13:48,150
feed to see all her stuff, or
you can follow one of her

1048
01:13:48,150 --> 01:13:50,640
albums, and then also see all of
the other stuff that she

1049
01:13:50,640 --> 01:13:53,700
publishes to have the opposite
opportunity to follow those. Can

1050
01:13:53,700 --> 01:13:59,160
Adam Curry: I interject an ad?
Yes. RSS blue.com/music. There's

1051
01:13:59,160 --> 01:14:02,700
now a new path, whether you're
doing a show or an artist or

1052
01:14:02,700 --> 01:14:05,760
whatever you want with music,
RSS blue.com/music.

1053
01:14:06,570 --> 01:14:11,160
Dave Jones: That was a freebie.
That's right. So that's the way

1054
01:14:11,160 --> 01:14:17,040
that that's the way that it
currently. The idea is, so then

1055
01:14:18,810 --> 01:14:24,810
the issue here is on the feed
side itself, not the publisher

1056
01:14:24,810 --> 01:14:27,480
feed but on the on the podcast
feed, right, because we need

1057
01:14:27,480 --> 01:14:31,170
that reference back. You need
the reference back in the way we

1058
01:14:31,170 --> 01:14:35,670
had, where we had originally, we
bounced round a couple of

1059
01:14:35,670 --> 01:14:40,800
things. And where I had landed
was I initially was like, I

1060
01:14:40,800 --> 01:14:44,130
don't think we need to have a
publisher tag, we can just have

1061
01:14:44,130 --> 01:14:49,410
a remote item with a medium
equals publisher. And then that

1062
01:14:49,410 --> 01:14:52,860
if that's found in the channel,
then that's your reference. And

1063
01:14:52,860 --> 01:14:56,670
I still think that's okay.
That's an that's an OK way to do

1064
01:14:56,670 --> 01:14:59,610
it. But I've got a couple of
I've started to change my tune a

1065
01:14:59,610 --> 01:15:02,790
little bit. On this, and I'm now
thinking that that remote item,

1066
01:15:03,510 --> 01:15:08,850
Thomas Rin, popped into GitHub
and the podcast index dot social

1067
01:15:08,850 --> 01:15:12,510
and said that he really thinks
that that remote item

1068
01:15:13,560 --> 01:15:19,050
referencing the publisher feed
should be wrapped in a publisher

1069
01:15:19,050 --> 01:15:25,980
tag, something like podcast,
podcast colon publisher. And

1070
01:15:25,980 --> 01:15:27,390
originally, I was like, yeah.

1071
01:15:29,670 --> 01:15:31,740
Adam Curry: I've heard that
noise before, it's usually not a

1072
01:15:31,740 --> 01:15:32,370
good sign.

1073
01:15:33,540 --> 01:15:38,460
Dave Jones: And so but then I
started thinking about it more

1074
01:15:38,460 --> 01:15:44,010
than like, you know, I think he,
I think he might be, right. This

1075
01:15:44,010 --> 01:15:46,590
is not really a right or wrong
issue. This, I just, I just

1076
01:15:46,650 --> 01:15:50,640
think I like the way that that
feels better. And here's the

1077
01:15:50,640 --> 01:15:59,010
reasons. I don't like the way
atom at O M, Atom feeds. I don't

1078
01:15:59,010 --> 01:16:05,550
like I've never liked the way
that they use link tags. So Atom

1079
01:16:05,580 --> 01:16:13,170
feeds have a bunch of link tags
with different rel equals into

1080
01:16:13,170 --> 01:16:16,140
two different differentiate what
their, what their

1081
01:16:16,140 --> 01:16:18,990
Adam Curry: meanings are. That's
where rel equals mi comes from.

1082
01:16:20,010 --> 01:16:21,930
Dave Jones: Well, no, that's
different. That's, that's a link

1083
01:16:21,930 --> 01:16:28,140
mess of metadata ahead. Yeah.
Disregard, disregarded. So I

1084
01:16:28,140 --> 01:16:32,040
don't like the way that that is
because what it makes you have

1085
01:16:32,040 --> 01:16:36,690
to do is iterate the whole link
list. In this is, this is at a

1086
01:16:36,690 --> 01:16:40,140
code level now that I'm talking
about, when you when you parse

1087
01:16:40,140 --> 01:16:44,640
an Atom feed, you have one or
two, you have two choices, you

1088
01:16:44,640 --> 01:16:50,250
can either parse the entire link
list, each time you're looking

1089
01:16:50,250 --> 01:16:54,060
for a specific type type of
link, let's say you're looking

1090
01:16:54,060 --> 01:16:58,110
for web sub links, you're gonna
have to run the entire link list

1091
01:16:58,110 --> 01:17:02,550
and find that specific rel equal
link that you're looking for.

1092
01:17:05,850 --> 01:17:10,110
Otherwise, you end up or you end
up with a loop in your code with

1093
01:17:10,110 --> 01:17:13,710
a dependent sort of dependent
parsing functions coming out of

1094
01:17:13,710 --> 01:17:19,590
that code, which has sort of a
lot of fingers. It just doesn't

1095
01:17:19,590 --> 01:17:23,280
fit in either one of them, when
you just have a list like that.

1096
01:17:25,740 --> 01:17:29,610
I don't know, it just doesn't
feel good to me. Because here's

1097
01:17:29,610 --> 01:17:34,500
the issues because RSS doesn't
have a notion of a head and a

1098
01:17:34,500 --> 01:17:40,470
body section, like HTML does. So
in in HTML, if you want to put

1099
01:17:40,470 --> 01:17:42,810
some sort of metadata in there,
you can just stick it in the

1100
01:17:42,810 --> 01:17:49,680
head. In in, then you have a
body for the content. If RSS had

1101
01:17:49,680 --> 01:17:53,520
the notion of a head and a body
where the head held a bunch of

1102
01:17:53,520 --> 01:17:57,990
content, a sort of this type of
thing, and then the body had all

1103
01:17:57,990 --> 01:18:02,070
the items or the episodes, there
would be a little bit more

1104
01:18:02,280 --> 01:18:05,880
logical separation between these
things. But there's, we don't

1105
01:18:05,880 --> 01:18:10,140
have that everything's just in a
flat list called the channel. So

1106
01:18:10,170 --> 01:18:14,670
it says everything's in the
channel, wrapping things in a

1107
01:18:14,670 --> 01:18:21,510
sort of a parent tag. It really
helps with the parsing of it. It

1108
01:18:21,510 --> 01:18:24,660
gives a little a little bit more
logical, like structure to the

1109
01:18:24,690 --> 01:18:29,040
to the data. So um, and we kind
of do that already.

1110
01:18:29,610 --> 01:18:32,070
Adam Curry: Can I Can I ask a
crazy question?

1111
01:18:33,000 --> 01:18:33,990
Dave Jones: The crazier the
better?

1112
01:18:35,190 --> 01:18:37,650
Adam Curry: Why aren't we just
using OPML for this?

1113
01:18:40,530 --> 01:18:46,440
Dave Jones: Yeah, that that came
up, except that OPML everything

1114
01:18:46,440 --> 01:18:52,920
in podcasting is geared towards
RSS. On the subscription front.

1115
01:18:53,970 --> 01:18:57,270
And it's just, it would be such
it would be a big it'd be a

1116
01:18:57,270 --> 01:19:01,830
heavy lift to make people parse
OPML. Okay, because let's be

1117
01:19:01,830 --> 01:19:03,480
honest, oh, P mails a weird
based.

1118
01:19:04,230 --> 01:19:05,130
Adam Curry: I always loved it.

1119
01:19:06,150 --> 01:19:08,550
Dave Jones: Now, I love it, too,
but it's a weird one. I mean,

1120
01:19:08,550 --> 01:19:09,810
it's a weird, dude. Well,

1121
01:19:09,810 --> 01:19:11,910
Adam Curry: for sure people
don't know the true power of it.

1122
01:19:11,910 --> 01:19:14,340
They only no list of RSS feeds.

1123
01:19:15,330 --> 01:19:18,750
Dave Jones: Yeah. Like,
everything's an outline tag.

1124
01:19:18,780 --> 01:19:22,200
Yeah, that's that. I think it
just blows people's minds. Okay,

1125
01:19:22,230 --> 01:19:26,730
so all right, but yeah, so it's
a way that I think that we kind

1126
01:19:26,730 --> 01:19:30,180
of already do this with with
media. See, like, value

1127
01:19:30,180 --> 01:19:34,500
recipient? Yeah, that can have a
remote item in it. You know, in

1128
01:19:34,500 --> 01:19:38,670
a value time split and these
kinds of these. It's rare that

1129
01:19:38,670 --> 01:19:42,540
the remote item lives on its own
unless it's in a playlist

1130
01:19:42,750 --> 01:19:50,490
medium. And so I think I think
it makes sense. If I think

1131
01:19:50,520 --> 01:19:54,210
either will be clearer, I think
either way will work. But I

1132
01:19:54,210 --> 01:19:58,170
kinda like the wrapping and
apparent publisher tag better.

1133
01:19:59,010 --> 01:20:02,310
So I think I think we kind of
need to figure that part out

1134
01:20:02,310 --> 01:20:07,830
real quick. And then we can pull
the trigger on on getting this

1135
01:20:07,830 --> 01:20:12,120
thing formalized. Okay.
finalized Excuse me. So I'm

1136
01:20:12,120 --> 01:20:16,860
gonna I'm gonna, I'm gonna push
that agenda. He's got on his

1137
01:20:16,860 --> 01:20:17,460
podcast and

1138
01:20:18,779 --> 01:20:20,429
Adam Curry: agenda. He's got an
agenda.

1139
01:20:20,790 --> 01:20:24,570
Dave Jones: I got an agenda.
It's in, it's in, it's got to do

1140
01:20:24,570 --> 01:20:27,360
with publishers. And we're going
to end I'm going to push that on

1141
01:20:27,360 --> 01:20:30,420
podcast, index dot social and
GitHub, and hopefully we can get

1142
01:20:30,420 --> 01:20:31,350
that one over the finish line.

1143
01:20:31,650 --> 01:20:36,690
Adam Curry: So just while we're
on this briefly, where do we fit

1144
01:20:36,690 --> 01:20:42,600
in the concept of tags for
music? Because I promised that

1145
01:20:42,600 --> 01:20:43,470
bring this up.

1146
01:20:44,100 --> 01:20:46,200
Dave Jones: Yes, I've got that
on my notes as well. I'll house

1147
01:20:46,200 --> 01:20:49,830
hoping to talk about that next
week with Sam. Ah, yes, thanks.

1148
01:20:49,830 --> 01:20:49,950
He's

1149
01:20:49,950 --> 01:20:51,690
Adam Curry: got a lot to say
about that weird idea.

1150
01:20:52,740 --> 01:20:55,110
Dave Jones: I don't think we're
far away from this. I don't

1151
01:20:55,110 --> 01:20:57,900
think that there's much that we
have to do, because we've

1152
01:20:57,900 --> 01:21:02,790
already hashed out so much of it
in the past. But I think it'd be

1153
01:21:02,790 --> 01:21:05,580
good to have a verbal
conversation about it with him

1154
01:21:05,580 --> 01:21:09,840
next week. And I think, here's,
I think we can get all of this

1155
01:21:09,840 --> 01:21:11,100
done by June 1.

1156
01:21:11,820 --> 01:21:12,270
Adam Curry: Okay,

1157
01:21:12,360 --> 01:21:14,910
Dave Jones: so another month and
I think we're, I think we're

1158
01:21:14,910 --> 01:21:18,330
because people are already
building it. Wave lakes already

1159
01:21:18,330 --> 01:21:20,580
putting they're building both of
these, they're gonna have these

1160
01:21:20,580 --> 01:21:24,780
things. shippable this month?
Clean this is this is happening.

1161
01:21:25,140 --> 01:21:25,650
Publisher

1162
01:21:25,680 --> 01:21:26,670
Adam Curry: publisher feeds?

1163
01:21:27,060 --> 01:21:28,140
Dave Jones: Yeah. And
categories,

1164
01:21:28,200 --> 01:21:30,270
Adam Curry: or tags are
excellent. Excellent. I gotta

1165
01:21:30,270 --> 01:21:34,350
tell you, I was listening to
phantom power music. Our I think

1166
01:21:34,350 --> 01:21:38,520
it is there's like a million
phantom power podcast, and named

1167
01:21:38,520 --> 01:21:42,960
for a podcast and he had on. I
think the guys from the trusted,

1168
01:21:43,440 --> 01:21:45,810
which are a bunch of British
guys didn't even realize that.

1169
01:21:46,350 --> 01:21:49,740
And the you just listening to
them? Used to them? They're

1170
01:21:49,740 --> 01:21:52,470
like, Oh, yeah, this Nasr thing,
they don't even know what

1171
01:21:52,470 --> 01:21:55,890
they're talking about. But then,
but then they Yeah, you know,

1172
01:21:55,890 --> 01:21:59,520
people are sharing on the
podcast, and I can, can feel the

1173
01:21:59,520 --> 01:22:03,900
artists are starting to catch on
the end. And when artists catch

1174
01:22:03,900 --> 01:22:07,860
on to something, and they get
100,000 SATs, you know, they're

1175
01:22:07,860 --> 01:22:12,390
like, Ah, how do we get
involved? And they, please,

1176
01:22:13,110 --> 01:22:15,690
yeah, but it's not just the
money. It's like, we can't

1177
01:22:15,690 --> 01:22:18,540
believe someone's doing
something. It's like someone's

1178
01:22:18,540 --> 01:22:21,900
doing something. The song Yeah,
someone's playing our song over

1179
01:22:21,900 --> 01:22:24,450
here. And we're finding out
about it over there. And

1180
01:22:24,480 --> 01:22:27,150
there's, there's value and it's
a lot more value than they get

1181
01:22:27,150 --> 01:22:30,840
them they get nothing zero value
of any platform, because they

1182
01:22:30,840 --> 01:22:35,700
never hit the $50 threshold or
whatever. And it's exciting. I

1183
01:22:35,700 --> 01:22:38,760
mean, I always have to remind
myself these things, these

1184
01:22:38,760 --> 01:22:43,350
things take time. takes time.
Yeah, it really does. But it's

1185
01:22:43,350 --> 01:22:48,150
happening. It really is. And you
can see more and more just the

1186
01:22:48,150 --> 01:22:51,930
features in the apps, the way
they're being displayed. The

1187
01:22:51,930 --> 01:22:55,320
things that people are coming up
with, I mean, it's rolling, it's

1188
01:22:55,320 --> 01:23:00,030
rolling, and it's small, but
it's it's going to it's just

1189
01:23:00,030 --> 01:23:04,050
going through RSS is and the
apps they're going to be the

1190
01:23:04,050 --> 01:23:09,000
distribution mechanism in for
the foreseeable future it really

1191
01:23:09,000 --> 01:23:12,510
are freely really are is
everyone's starting to see it

1192
01:23:13,170 --> 01:23:16,770
say well how can get on all
these platforms be ignored

1193
01:23:16,770 --> 01:23:20,100
they're talking about but I get
all these platforms just by

1194
01:23:20,130 --> 01:23:22,650
uploading it this way. You know

1195
01:23:23,970 --> 01:23:25,230
Dave Jones: are you gonna play a
song today?

1196
01:23:25,260 --> 01:23:27,450
Adam Curry: I have a song if you
if you want to you want you want

1197
01:23:27,450 --> 01:23:31,890
to hear song? Yeah. Is it the
trusted No, it's not the trust

1198
01:23:31,890 --> 01:23:34,410
but you might want to hold on to
your to your britches for this

1199
01:23:34,410 --> 01:23:45,390
one right I picked this one just
for you Dave. It says the retro

1200
01:23:45,390 --> 01:23:49,590
grade as heard on booster Grand
Ball in many other places it's I

1201
01:23:49,590 --> 01:23:50,490
need a little

1202
01:23:58,380 --> 01:23:58,920
Unknown: again

1203
01:24:15,510 --> 01:24:16,440
CZ Houston

1204
01:24:23,160 --> 01:24:23,670
is over

1205
01:24:35,100 --> 01:24:35,400
guys

1206
01:25:00,000 --> 01:25:16,200
Dave Jones: Are you

1207
01:25:31,890 --> 01:25:32,730
Unknown: busy used to?

1208
01:27:35,070 --> 01:27:38,700
Adam Curry: cruising around
Hello girls I got my stereo

1209
01:27:38,700 --> 01:27:45,330
crank just for you the
retrograde I need a little Yeah,

1210
01:27:45,360 --> 01:27:46,170
it's good, isn't it?

1211
01:27:46,680 --> 01:27:50,220
Dave Jones: Yeah, I like that.
That prompted you for the music

1212
01:27:50,220 --> 01:27:51,930
because I was had to pee right.

1213
01:27:53,010 --> 01:27:54,540
Adam Curry: That's what we do in
radio.

1214
01:27:56,250 --> 01:27:58,590
Dave Jones: I'm a real radio
guy, shall we?

1215
01:27:58,590 --> 01:28:02,160
Adam Curry: Thanks some people
here Dave Jones. We should think

1216
01:28:02,940 --> 01:28:05,520
Dave Jones: some people in and
out Oberto in the in the boys

1217
01:28:05,520 --> 01:28:10,170
and girls calm Oh $1,000

1218
01:28:11,280 --> 01:28:14,310
Unknown: stock Carla 20 is
blades on him.

1219
01:28:15,600 --> 01:28:17,130
Adam Curry: Advertising can beat
that.

1220
01:28:18,270 --> 01:28:21,030
Dave Jones: Adam and Dave,
here's some value back at you

1221
01:28:21,030 --> 01:28:24,420
and the podcast in Tupelo, all
stars. Thank you everyone for

1222
01:28:24,420 --> 01:28:28,380
your time of talent. Treasure.
It's very time talent treasure.

1223
01:28:28,620 --> 01:28:30,420
Let's get together in
Fredericksburg. One of these

1224
01:28:30,420 --> 01:28:34,200
days smoked beef shake. Oh,

1225
01:28:34,200 --> 01:28:39,210
Adam Curry: I get it. I like
that idea. Yeah. We need a

1226
01:28:39,480 --> 01:28:42,690
friend meet up for sure. For
sure. Thank you. Thank you guys.

1227
01:28:42,690 --> 01:28:47,220
Thank you. The hosters are
always the big supporters. Let

1228
01:28:47,220 --> 01:28:51,150
me go through a couple of the
the boosts booster grams that

1229
01:28:51,150 --> 01:28:56,250
came in during the show. I heard
a lot of pews. 7777 little

1230
01:28:56,250 --> 01:29:00,720
striper boost from circus media
boost on episode 175 Go music

1231
01:29:00,720 --> 01:29:06,390
podcasting. And there's big
10,000 SATs from music mama. She

1232
01:29:06,390 --> 01:29:11,040
says we can feel it. That's Ames
this mom. We can feel it. I can

1233
01:29:11,040 --> 01:29:15,480
feel Sam Sethi 10,000 sets. We
have publisher feeds and artists

1234
01:29:15,480 --> 01:29:18,570
fees. You can follow a publisher
feed if they add a new track or

1235
01:29:18,570 --> 01:29:21,480
a new podcast or their slate
we'll send you a notification.

1236
01:29:22,770 --> 01:29:27,630
So I'm talking 2222 from
blueberry Dave, you're saying

1237
01:29:27,630 --> 01:29:30,540
one could make a post and
activity pub and tase our GIMP

1238
01:29:30,540 --> 01:29:36,330
on the podcast? Saying yes, I'm
liking it

1239
01:29:37,140 --> 01:29:38,910
Dave Jones: early. That's what I
meant subconsciously.

1240
01:29:39,150 --> 01:29:42,930
Adam Curry: Another 10k from Sam
Sethi from true fans. I'm

1241
01:29:42,930 --> 01:29:45,840
working hard to link activity
stream to activity pub. You and

1242
01:29:45,840 --> 01:29:48,780
Dave have invented the new ad
model but just don't know it

1243
01:29:48,780 --> 01:29:53,040
yet. VTS SATs and remote item we
will have activity stream to

1244
01:29:53,040 --> 01:29:56,310
activity pub working to demo
next week. Good because I don't

1245
01:29:56,310 --> 01:30:00,090
understand anything that we just
said. Fun. I'm excited I I'm

1246
01:30:00,090 --> 01:30:03,390
excited. Hey Dave, whatever it
is we invented it just so you

1247
01:30:03,390 --> 01:30:07,380
know we did we invent it before
you know what the wiki pedia

1248
01:30:07,380 --> 01:30:11,670
will say we were promoters of
it. Yep. Stakeholders. If you

1249
01:30:11,670 --> 01:30:14,910
look at the Wikipedia, Adam
Curry was a podcast enthusiast.

1250
01:30:17,490 --> 01:30:20,160
Dave Jones: An enthusiast. Yeah,
just my favorite. My favorite

1251
01:30:20,160 --> 01:30:25,830
tweet ever from you. It hands it
hands down is Spotify. Put out a

1252
01:30:25,830 --> 01:30:32,700
tweet that said Tell us about
your RSS. Tell us about No. Tell

1253
01:30:32,700 --> 01:30:36,090
us about your podcasting,
relationship, your relationship

1254
01:30:36,090 --> 01:30:39,030
to podcasting. It was just one
of those engagement getters.

1255
01:30:39,510 --> 01:30:42,060
Tell us about your relationship
to podcasting and you replied

1256
01:30:42,060 --> 01:30:43,170
and said invented it.

1257
01:30:44,280 --> 01:30:46,710
Adam Curry: Oh, there you go.
Not Not according to the

1258
01:30:46,710 --> 01:30:50,520
Wikipedia though. Bro. Ducks
from Dave Jackson coming in from

1259
01:30:50,520 --> 01:30:53,130
Casta Matic gonna try this again
from Castle Matic speaking of

1260
01:30:53,130 --> 01:30:56,580
marketing, advertising and
coffee. I still say censeo after

1261
01:30:56,580 --> 01:31:00,420
I burp. Thanks, Adam. How do I
get deeper? How do I get the pro

1262
01:31:00,450 --> 01:31:05,730
deprogrammed? You can't that's
going on on 18 years that people

1263
01:31:05,790 --> 01:31:09,060
that was that was my advertising
test and it still works never

1264
01:31:09,060 --> 01:31:14,220
got paid. 2220 from Dave Jackson
again speaking of coffee

1265
01:31:14,220 --> 01:31:17,640
advertising and branding every
time he did it twice so it came

1266
01:31:17,640 --> 01:31:22,770
through on true fans as well.
Three times true twice from true

1267
01:31:22,770 --> 01:31:27,240
fans there you go. Once on
Sunday, yes right Jean ever 3333

1268
01:31:27,240 --> 01:31:31,140
Live boosts from Highway 684 in
New York. That's right. Wave to

1269
01:31:31,140 --> 01:31:36,780
Armonk on your way past. Dave
Jackson did it again with true

1270
01:31:36,780 --> 01:31:40,710
fans is true fans is great for
our wallet. Whatever true fans

1271
01:31:40,710 --> 01:31:46,200
is doing more of it. We invented
it 7777 Again from circus media

1272
01:31:46,200 --> 01:31:50,160
more options more choices, more
freedom go podcasting. The tone

1273
01:31:50,160 --> 01:31:52,620
record catching the live feed
today always refreshing with a

1274
01:31:52,620 --> 01:31:57,840
row of ducks Guy Martin 7777
boosting and from true fans.

1275
01:31:57,840 --> 01:32:01,200
Yes, please. I'd love to be in
the dev alpha and beta of an

1276
01:32:01,200 --> 01:32:02,640
audio book app. There you go.

1277
01:32:03,270 --> 01:32:05,460
Dave Jones: And you don't have
to make it now.

1278
01:32:06,450 --> 01:32:10,650
Adam Curry: Sam Ceci with 1000
SATs cough we support medium

1279
01:32:10,680 --> 01:32:14,310
equal Audrey audio books will
work with her head to understand

1280
01:32:14,310 --> 01:32:18,240
the problem the issue was
finding feeds Okay, that should

1281
01:32:18,240 --> 01:32:26,010
be that should be solvable. Yep.
Eric pp roadex went to 22 he was

1282
01:32:26,700 --> 01:32:31,200
interesting he boosted it boost
wow that's weird. He boosted a

1283
01:32:31,200 --> 01:32:35,940
song. I don't know how that even
worked. I don't know what do you

1284
01:32:35,940 --> 01:32:38,880
what add something showed up
from curio Cassatt? I'm not sure

1285
01:32:38,880 --> 01:32:46,560
what's going on. Eric PP and
other 3333 We've got a hit the

1286
01:32:46,560 --> 01:32:48,240
delimiter. So over to you Bob.

1287
01:32:51,420 --> 01:32:56,460
Dave Jones: Pod verse, Mitch and
Kreon over in collibra pod verse

1288
01:32:56,490 --> 01:32:58,200
$50. Whoa,

1289
01:32:58,230 --> 01:32:59,100
Adam Curry: thank you very much.

1290
01:32:59,880 --> 01:33:04,170
Unknown: For that shots call off
20 blades on am Paula thank

1291
01:33:04,170 --> 01:33:04,890
Adam Curry: you much.

1292
01:33:05,280 --> 01:33:07,140
Dave Jones: Eric. BP says he
doesn't know what he did either.

1293
01:33:09,780 --> 01:33:16,230
Beats Music podcasts and $33.33
three Thank you. says how the

1294
01:33:16,230 --> 01:33:19,500
boardroom boardroom Dave, it's
that time of the year for

1295
01:33:19,500 --> 01:33:23,520
tornado chasing yes it is. It
absolutely is gracious. Here's a

1296
01:33:23,520 --> 01:33:26,220
little donation to help top off
your climate change and help

1297
01:33:26,220 --> 01:33:28,800
keep the lights on go podcast go

1298
01:33:28,800 --> 01:33:29,940
Adam Curry: podcasting as you

1299
01:33:31,890 --> 01:33:38,100
Dave Jones: see we have Jesse
Anderson $33 No note thank you

1300
01:33:38,100 --> 01:33:43,980
Jessie. Alright, and that's our
paper towels. We got some boosts

1301
01:33:43,980 --> 01:33:49,680
Adam Curry: boost boost. Boost
boost boost boost boost motion

1302
01:33:49,680 --> 01:33:54,780
here we go. By the way I just
say I'm loving it Barry who's

1303
01:33:54,780 --> 01:33:57,420
doing the all about podcasting
podcast.

1304
01:33:58,170 --> 01:33:58,980
Dave Jones: Yeah, yeah.

1305
01:33:59,460 --> 01:34:00,720
Adam Curry: He's cool podcast.

1306
01:34:01,470 --> 01:34:06,720
Dave Jones: He is alive. Live
Event guy. Yeah. He loves doing

1307
01:34:06,720 --> 01:34:07,170
those things.

1308
01:34:07,200 --> 01:34:10,260
Adam Curry: Yeah, he's got. He's
interviewing everybody. It's

1309
01:34:10,260 --> 01:34:12,480
great. I love that. Love that
what you're doing

1310
01:34:13,710 --> 01:34:18,240
Dave Jones: 6969 from Pei
citizen, through pod verse. He

1311
01:34:18,240 --> 01:34:21,630
says pugnacious boost that's
when blueberry takes 10%

1312
01:34:22,950 --> 01:34:26,010
Adam Curry: Yeah, blueberry in
the split for today. So enjoy

1313
01:34:26,010 --> 01:34:26,670
blueberry. Okay,

1314
01:34:26,850 --> 01:34:30,060
Dave Jones: yeah, you could
double up there you go. See we

1315
01:34:30,060 --> 01:34:33,660
got Alan C Paul. Da boost this
is great interview with

1316
01:34:33,660 --> 01:34:37,110
blueberry and the song sold me
on checking out the concert God

1317
01:34:37,140 --> 01:34:39,480
Adam Curry: There you go. 12
rods it was a big success.

1318
01:34:41,010 --> 01:34:44,430
Dave Jones: Advertising through
V for V. Loc we got rusty

1319
01:34:44,430 --> 01:34:48,600
Calavera posting the see through
cast ematic he says Midwest is

1320
01:34:48,600 --> 01:34:49,200
best.

1321
01:34:50,340 --> 01:34:51,570
Adam Curry: True I can True
that.

1322
01:34:53,520 --> 01:34:56,820
Dave Jones: Say we get another
one of those and oh god the

1323
01:34:56,820 --> 01:35:00,840
delimiter comic strip blogger
22,000 SATs fan Anthony says,

1324
01:35:02,490 --> 01:35:06,150
howdy fellow simulation
dwellers, Adam and Dave, as an

1325
01:35:06,150 --> 01:35:08,760
agnostic, I think that the
likelihood of us living in a

1326
01:35:08,760 --> 01:35:11,580
simulation is greater than the
truthfulness of the religious

1327
01:35:11,580 --> 01:35:15,990
beliefs centered around Jesus.
However, if you hold the belief

1328
01:35:15,990 --> 01:35:19,620
that Christ is king, then I
encourage you to subscribe to

1329
01:35:19,620 --> 01:35:22,830
Adam and Tina Curry's podcast,
where they talk about Jesus

1330
01:35:22,830 --> 01:35:30,030
Bigley. You can you can find it
at www dot Currey and the

1331
01:35:30,030 --> 01:35:34,020
keeper.com they accept a boost
for grants from podcasting 2.0

1332
01:35:34,020 --> 01:35:37,950
apps, which Adam reads on the
show. Yo cssb

1333
01:35:37,980 --> 01:35:41,130
Adam Curry: Thank you so much
CSP he I love it. It's the only

1334
01:35:41,130 --> 01:35:45,690
person I know who boosts and of
course it's advertising just

1335
01:35:45,720 --> 01:35:48,960
just just pointing it out.
advertising

1336
01:35:48,960 --> 01:35:50,430
Dave Jones: for others he's
never selfish. He

1337
01:35:50,430 --> 01:35:52,890
Adam Curry: never never never
asked for himself once in a

1338
01:35:52,890 --> 01:35:56,730
while. It's CSB dot lol but then
that's true and far between

1339
01:35:56,730 --> 01:35:59,430
Thank you very much comics for
Blogger. You got any monthlies

1340
01:35:59,430 --> 01:35:59,820
Dave?

1341
01:36:00,090 --> 01:36:06,720
Dave Jones: Yeah got some
monthlies. Basil Philip $25

1342
01:36:07,140 --> 01:36:13,530
Thank you basil got Lauren ball
$24.20 Mitch Downey $10 Thank

1343
01:36:13,530 --> 01:36:18,060
you Mitch. Christopher horrible
Eric $10 Terry killer $5 and

1344
01:36:18,060 --> 01:36:20,220
Chris Cowan $5

1345
01:36:20,910 --> 01:36:23,760
Adam Curry: Well, thank you all
so much for your contributions

1346
01:36:23,760 --> 01:36:27,090
to podcasting. 2.0 it keeps
everything running all the

1347
01:36:27,090 --> 01:36:32,670
servers all the polars all the
machines the social we don't

1348
01:36:33,810 --> 01:36:36,870
that thing is that thing is
chugging along sometimes.

1349
01:36:37,260 --> 01:36:38,670
Dave Jones: How expensive is it
now?

1350
01:36:38,700 --> 01:36:43,440
Adam Curry: I think we're up to
9085 or 90 bucks a month

1351
01:36:44,340 --> 01:36:45,060
Dave Jones: ish

1352
01:36:45,120 --> 01:36:50,010
Adam Curry: yeah but it's really
data I mean it's storage it's we

1353
01:36:50,010 --> 01:36:53,730
had to build the database it's I
love maths though dot host

1354
01:36:54,060 --> 01:36:58,830
things a great outfit. I've
purchased many Mastodon services

1355
01:36:58,830 --> 01:37:02,100
from Mastodon hosts it works
very well but I've never seen

1356
01:37:02,100 --> 01:37:03,870
downtime. Never

1357
01:37:04,560 --> 01:37:09,990
Dave Jones: one one other thing
as far as the arsa.com donation

1358
01:37:11,070 --> 01:37:16,410
reminded me that we are working
behind the scenes with your arm

1359
01:37:16,410 --> 01:37:20,790
where I'm having talks
periodically with Roberto from

1360
01:37:20,790 --> 01:37:26,850
our sister calm and Tom over
Buzzsprout in which trying to

1361
01:37:27,030 --> 01:37:30,480
kind of come up with a with an
idea for how to fight the spam

1362
01:37:30,480 --> 01:37:31,050
feeds.

1363
01:37:31,080 --> 01:37:34,320
Adam Curry: Yes, yes. Good idea.
Very good. Yeah.

1364
01:37:34,830 --> 01:37:36,660
Dave Jones: Everybody's got good
ideas. So I think we're gonna

1365
01:37:36,780 --> 01:37:39,270
think we're gonna have a repost
soon where we can post some reg

1366
01:37:39,270 --> 01:37:41,850
x's for blogging and cool
things. So

1367
01:37:43,350 --> 01:37:45,660
Adam Curry: go to the podcast
index.org down at the bottom.

1368
01:37:45,870 --> 01:37:49,170
You got to read donate buttons,
one for your on chain Bitcoin.

1369
01:37:49,890 --> 01:37:54,330
Okay. And the other for your
Fiat Fiat fun coupons through

1370
01:37:54,360 --> 01:37:57,270
PayPal, we always appreciate
that. And of course, the way to

1371
01:37:57,270 --> 01:38:00,360
really do it is getting modern
podcast app modern podcast

1372
01:38:00,360 --> 01:38:04,020
apps.com To find out more about
podcasting, two dot o podcasting

1373
01:38:04,020 --> 01:38:08,730
two.org. And the value for value
which is a it's a content

1374
01:38:08,880 --> 01:38:12,840
format. It's a model. It's a
lifestyle. Value number four

1375
01:38:12,840 --> 01:38:19,350
value dot info. And one last
board matter. Since we have been

1376
01:38:19,350 --> 01:38:24,960
asked which I I'm flattered. I'm
flattered that we were asked the

1377
01:38:24,990 --> 01:38:30,360
podcasting 2.0 logo. All in
favor say aye. Aye. Okay. And

1378
01:38:30,360 --> 01:38:32,550
that concludes all of the
business for the boardroom.

1379
01:38:32,610 --> 01:38:33,720
Anything else from your side?

1380
01:38:36,270 --> 01:38:37,650
Dave Jones: No. Okay.

1381
01:38:38,610 --> 01:38:39,960
Adam Curry: Good. You're gonna
you're going back to work

1382
01:38:39,960 --> 01:38:42,330
because you're very close to the
deadline. Here are a couple more

1383
01:38:42,330 --> 01:38:45,630
days and tomorrow is tax day for
me tomorrow. I'm doing all the

1384
01:38:45,630 --> 01:38:46,290
taxes.

1385
01:38:46,860 --> 01:38:49,620
Dave Jones: Oh, you late, you
late filer. Oh,

1386
01:38:49,620 --> 01:38:52,650
Adam Curry: but but I have it
all set up. I just have to, you

1387
01:38:52,650 --> 01:38:55,320
know, I'm just waiting for the
button. Yeah, just I just I

1388
01:38:55,320 --> 01:38:59,670
wanted to delay the pain until
the very, very last minute for

1389
01:38:59,700 --> 01:39:03,270
Dave Jones: your your skirt and
your skirt of the limit. The

1390
01:39:03,270 --> 01:39:06,660
Monday deadline day is great.
Because everybody like you can

1391
01:39:06,660 --> 01:39:09,420
just like oh, I'll just do it
Monday. No,

1392
01:39:09,420 --> 01:39:11,610
Adam Curry: no, no, no, no, I'm
doing it Saturday. I'm doing

1393
01:39:11,610 --> 01:39:15,240
this. I'm doing that. Thank you
very much boardroom thanks,

1394
01:39:15,240 --> 01:39:17,550
everybody for showing up. Really
appreciate your booths.

1395
01:39:17,610 --> 01:39:20,610
Appreciate your support and your
feedback. A lot was discussed

1396
01:39:20,610 --> 01:39:24,240
today. Have yourselves a great
weekend. Dave. Brother, I love

1397
01:39:24,240 --> 01:39:27,030
you. I'll see you what we'll be
talking and we'll talk again on

1398
01:39:27,030 --> 01:39:27,840
the next board meeting.

1399
01:39:28,470 --> 01:39:29,340
Dave Jones: Alright man see you
bro.

1400
01:39:32,130 --> 01:39:34,830
Adam Curry: Join us here next
Friday for another board meeting

1401
01:39:34,860 --> 01:39:38,190
the official one of podcasting
2.0 We'll see you then. Bye bye

1402
01:39:54,300 --> 01:39:56,580
Unknown: did you do you hope you
have been listening to

1403
01:39:56,610 --> 01:40:02,460
podcasting 2.0 Visit podcast and
Doug Ford for more information

1404
01:40:02,880 --> 01:40:03,870
go podcast

1405
01:40:05,580 --> 01:40:06,720
Adam Curry: Thomas are banned